prometheus

Who can safely say that the battle between the Enterprise C and the Romulans defending the Klingon out post never happened the way it did in the end? I mean, no one really knew what happened aboard that ship during the battle. A group of Bynars could have went back wearing purple tracksuits singing Dirty by Christina Aguillera and defended the Klingons and from the outside it would have just looked like the Enterprise C! If we were to follow CJLP's theory then that would mean that during the first (pretty much) four series of TNG, Sela never existed because THAT was a different time line. I personally hate this 'alternate' time line crap. I feel that whatever happens happens no matter what - the Bill and Ted theory! We will put a bucket there later, so a bucket is there now! Time travel doesnt exist. And until it does, we can argue til we are blue in the face, about it. Without really proving anything. I think though that the battle occurred as it did. And that's that. My reason is because everything went back to EXACTLY as it was when the Enterprise C went back. And I think that had it went differently then that would have had a knock on effect that would have seen Worf with a bee hive and Picard drinking Peach Snaps in a Jacuzzi on the holodeck with Atilla the Hunn every day! I think that they way it ended up happening is the way it happened. Just like First Contact.

But the message is a true one, with out the aid of the Americans the Alies had no hope of winning the conflict.

 

Oh really? (I love American arrogance). Yee haa. Yes siree. Thank the Lord for the Americans! Whatever help they gave was about bloody time. As per usual, the Americans stood back and did nothing until they got their own toes stood on. Then they went forward like the big dumb steam roller that they were, shooting everything in sight. Im sure they loved that: shooting and bonking away. Typical.

I have read the theories to explain this, on the net, in the past. I can't remember them all but they were something like this:

That a disease struck the Klingons at this time causing them to temporarily loose their ridges

That the Klingons shown on TOS had been surgically altered so as to be able to infiltrate the Federation covertly on spy missions

That the increased human presence caused a fashion trend (!!!!) amongst some races to look more human

That an omnipotent being (like a Q) thought it would be funny to make Klingons look a bit more human for a while

Silly things like that. Do you have any more possible explanations - just for laughs!!!

I think that when a good thing ends in a good way, then it is best to leave it at that. All things end: it's just a matter of when and how. And to go out on a high leaves a series glowing, as opposed to dragging it out until it is worn down and thread bare.

I feel that since the time of 'The Undiscovered Country', an experimental 'firing while cloaked' ship would be perfected by the Klingons by the TNG era. I mean - they'd done the hard part. All it needed was perfected.

Oh right, is that how it goes? Thanks.

Riker, Q, La Forge and then Troi. Hmmm. And all 70,000 light years away from home. Well, I suppose it was interesting to see them. Troi looked completely different without the lilac cat suit and big wig - a lot more 'real'.

Can we think of any others? Just for fun of course :)

I think the Defiant was much needed as literally a vehicle for the crew to travel with. The whole 'stuck on a station' thing can become somewhat chlostraphobic (sp). I liked also how they got a small ship, so as not to overshadow the character that was Deep Space Nine itself. We have to admit that the Enterprise and Voyager were personalities in themselves. The Defiant has a minor personality. I think it was originally going to be called the Valiant. Or something. A funky little hot hatch! All it needs is a spoiler and some alloy wheels

And if you notice in Generations, most of the cast start of in their TNG uniforms and then, at some later stage, change into their DS9 style one.

The new comm badge (with the squarish back) was introduced in this film. I saw drawings for a proposed uniform, in a book. It looked very 'nautical' if you know what i mean with rank bands on the arms.

The new First Contact uniform was apparently made darker as what with the Borg/Dominion threats etc, it was a better colour for the battle field: ie you arent lit up like a Christmas tree!!!

Sometimes, i think, we should continue as we never know what we may find - it could end up changing our lives.

If I had've been a Trekkie in the early 80s and went to see Wrath of Khan, seeing a young female Captain and the Enterprise crew killed like that would have gotten me fooled! Very dramatic.

Howeverm, as for music and atmosphere, I would go with First Contact. That music was great. So melancholy and a great set up for what was to come.

Personally, as a family I think that they are awful. The kids arent disciplined enough and they are overly crude. As a television programme it is a hoot. I think Ozzy is very funny, especially when he works out to Tina Turner!

I think that debating about time travel is just as meritous as debating about leprachauns: it doesnt exist and until it has been proven, tested, etc etc then there is no point postulating what is right and wrong. I like 'time travel' episodes purely because they give a fresh perspective on a given. I dont think that it is over used on Trek because, as the Traveller said on Tng, time space and thought are all one so time may be just as big a thing as space is... if you know what i mean!!! Exploring time may be like exploring space! Maybe that is what Enterprise is discovering: time as a sort of newer frontier. Anyway, i jabber!

Hello there to all you guys and a very happy new year. I know this is a wee bit self indulgant starting a topic purely to say hello but im rarely in here these days due to busy work stuff and lack of internet. Though the good news is im getting a computer in January (for 20 pounds from work - which is about 1000 dollars ) ) and internet so my rank should be pushed up a notch after that. Im very well. Sat my Bar exams last week (so glad to get them over) which are basically exams that get you train to be a Barrister (lawyer). Was out boozin last night and have a massive head on me (forgot my mobile and hoping to god i havent lost it). Got bad boyfriend trouble - sigh - men are all b*stards, if you pardon my Frenmch but no need to go there. Looking forward to New Year =- not!!!! so expensive. Watched a great film called Billy Elliot over the hols. Dont know if you Americanos have seen it (It's British) but it is very very good. About a working class boy who wants to be a dancer - he's not gay though, but very good. Apart from that - all is well. Let me know how you guys are doing and i WILL come in here and check up soon. Laters x x k

I loved the battle scene in First Contact. Gave you more of a sense that they were in 3D space. Also, remember Khan's mistake in Wrath ....

Thor class. Heavy cruiser with thick shielding and multiple phaser arrays/torpedo launchers. High warp capability. Would be short and wide. Short warp nacelles low, tucked under the ship. The bridge would be at the centre of the ship and the warp core at the rear in a detachable aft section. A lot like the Steam Runner class, only sleeker lines.

I think that the whole 'bridge on top', 'nacelles held on with skinny struts' thing was always impractical, especially in warfare. Having your captain raised at the top of the ship: crazy!

No, because this was mentioned in Yesterdays Enterprise, a TNG episode that was created long before Captain Archer's character was ever even conceived of.  It is possible that they could turn it into a reference but that was not it's original intent.  Don't take this the wrong way (I really mean no offence by it)but I have a hard time understanding why people try to see relationships between things when they are just coincidences. 

Just a bit of fun. Im not stupid.... :biggrin:

Why was the future destroyed?  It takes time for effects to ripple through the timeline.  Therefore, the futuristic 29th century is the correct one.  This because we see it before the changes are made to it, and those changes are prevented by their time travel, thus the timeline does not get altered. 

That's not entirely accurate.

 

2377 - Voyager remains in the Delta Quadrant.

2393 - Voyager returns to Earth.

2403 - Admiral Janeway travels back in time.

2377 - Voyagre returns to Earth, 16 years early.

29th Century - Episodes "Future's End" & "Relativity".

 

From the 29th century's point of view, the timeline where Voyager returned home 16 years early is the correct one. The reason is that the whole "Endgame" fiasco happens "before" the 29th century comes along. Now, if someone had traveled from the 29th century and allterred the 24th century history, "then" the 29th century good guys would know history's been messed with and would know to fix it.:(

:( For heaven's sakes! Not again.

I like the new tricorders as they look more functional. A wee screen that gives you images: worth 50 times more than a row of flashing LEDs!

Janeway, I suppose. She bore all the difficult decisions, faced depression, etc

I hated Kai Winn,the witch(that slur wants so bad to start with another letter... :( ).She was more pathetic than anything.

Gul Dukat,now there was a true villain.He had a dynamic personality,and he was convinced of the "righteousness" of his own cause.To tell the truth and shame the devil,as we say down here,Dukat might have convinced me to switch sides (Marc Alaimo is a doll :( ).

Nah.Maybe not,I'm too much a believer in the Federation and Starfleet.But I wouldn't have minded him tempting me.Sigh...

I think Kai Winn was a much more subtle villan though. She was equally as evil yet kept up an efficacy of being a good religious leader. This made her a lot more dangerous. Sisko could tell Dukat where to go: he knew where he was with him. But he had to keep friendly with the sceming Kai, knowing what she was capable of. I find the secretive schemer the most dangerous.

Any relation to the Captain, do you think?

Well. Im half way through season two and again im seeing a lot of episodes where Trip and Archer get captured and Trip goes in his vest stranded on a planet... i know it'll get better!

He could have gone evil, like Khan. Cool. Dr Evil Bashir.

Fury is the only VOY episode that I havent seen.