Lessa_Soong 0 Posted June 15, 2003 I was just wondering if anyone else thought it was odd that in ENT the mind melds is seen as a perversion and a illness spreading practice, yet only 100 years later, in Spocks time is it well used among all, part of the marriage ritual, used to rejoin Spocks Katra with his body, used at the age of seven to bond a male child to his future wife etc. How could the transition so fast? opinions? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A l t e r E g o 9 Posted June 15, 2003 Yeah I think it’s odd but what can we do? Tptb have made the claim First Contact has altered the timeline (although how those changes could have affected thousands of years of Vulcan history escapes me ) so I either accept it and wait to see what happens or I become a basher. It is not logical but I have chosen to wait and see what happens, perhaps Trek will again pull one of it’s famous rabbits out of it’s hat and it will all make sense by the end of ENT’s run. *Our Father who art in Heaven hallowed be thy name...* Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TransporterMalfunction 1 Posted June 15, 2003 Well 100 years is a long time. Just look at the sexual revolution of our society in the past 40 years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ddillard 2 Posted June 15, 2003 Well 100 years is a long time. Just look at the sexual revolution of our society in the past 40 years. Very good point. We have went from women having very little right, and not even able to vote. To them being CEO's of major corporations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lessa_Soong 0 Posted June 16, 2003 I just thougth it it was quite a leap to go from wanting to punish poeple from mind melding to beening a huge part of their culture in such a short time. Remember Vulcans live 200 years or so, so this is in half of a live time for these people. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yillara Skye 1 Posted June 16, 2003 Tptb have made the claim First Contact has altered the timeline (although how those changes could have affected thousands of years of Vulcan history escapes me ) I guess they think that everything changes...history wise whether it be human, Romulan, Klingon....and all we can really do is shrug our shoulders and accept it... And in the case of how things could change so drastically in 100 years... I agree with this... QUOTE (TransporterMalfunction @ Jun 15 2003, 11:45 AM) Well 100 years is a long time. Just look at the sexual revolution of our society in the past 40 years. Very good point. We have went from women having very little right, and not even able to vote. To them being CEO's of major corporations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Goose 0 Posted June 16, 2003 Stardate:213455.8 Maybe something big happens involving the mind meld over that time period that changes their minds.Just a thought. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KayTroi 0 Posted June 16, 2003 I too did not understand that either. The mind meld is used as a way to communicate between loved ones. It isn't seen as an illness. The mind meld is there to help not hurt. Maybe, it was different a 100 years before Spock. But, I think they were trying to find a way to introduce the mind meld to the new explorers of space.(Cpt.Archer and his crew) Or the writers for Enterprise are trying to shove another idea down our throats in hopes that we accept what they are telling us. :lol: It's just a thought. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A l t e r E g o 9 Posted July 9, 2003 Tptb have made the claim First Contact has altered the timeline (although how those changes could have affected thousands of years of Vulcan history escapes me ) I guess they think that everything changes...history wise whether it be human, Romulan, Klingon....and all we can really do is shrug our shoulders and accept it... And in the case of how things could change so drastically in 100 years... I agree with this... QUOTE (TransporterMalfunction @ Jun 15 2003, 11:45 AM) Well 100 years is a long time. Just look at the sexual revolution of our society in the past 40 years. Very good point. We have went from women having very little right, and not even able to vote. To them being CEO's of major corporations. Yeah, when you put it that way it does make sense. MORE ENTERPRISE NOW! :lol: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrskirk 0 Posted July 9, 2003 I may be wrong (it's been a while since I saw the Ent episode being discussed here) but I believe the meld was forced on T'Pol without her permission. Forced melds are considered a crime in Vulcan society even in the TOS and TNG eras. That is why Spock hesitated when Kirk ordered him to meld with Valeris and find out who her co-conspirators were in Star Trek VI. Vulcans consider a forced meld a form of rape, and I believe a Vulcan convicted of forcing a mind meld on another without that person's permission can be sentenced to death. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A l t e r E g o 9 Posted July 9, 2003 Hmmm... In Stigma, I thought it was being made perfectly clear, in Vulcan society of that time, all melders were sinners. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Data 0 Posted July 9, 2003 I was just wondering if anyone else thought it was odd that in ENT the mind melds is seen as a perversion and a illness spreading practice, yet only 100 years later, in Spocks time is it well used among all, part of the marriage ritual, used to rejoin Spocks Katra with his body, used at the age of seven to bond a male child to his future wife etc. How could the transition so fast? opinions? Actually a lot can happen in a hundred years. The episode "Stigma" was actually a message episode about people's attitude today towards AIDs. That was how the writers of Enterprise wanted to handle it. If you wish, I could look up the information. I believe Spock did mention some of the thngs that could happen to a person who participated in a mind meld. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lessa_Soong 0 Posted July 9, 2003 I understood the "hiden" meaning, but it just seemed strange to me that it was something to transmit "MTD", but 100 years later all is peaches and cream in this area. If you have any info to add Data, please do! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yillara Skye 1 Posted July 9, 2003 I understood the "hiden" meaning, but it just seemed strange to me that it was something to transmit "MTD", but 100 years later all is peaches and cream in this area. If you have any info to add Data, please do! I can understand what you mean Lessa, it does seem odd to have a turnaround like that...hmmm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ensign_beedrill 0 Posted July 9, 2003 Yes, it is something odd that I have wondered about. But I'm sure that it is something that will be explained. Think of this. Just fifty years ago, the Civil Rights movements were going on. Segregation was still in place in the south. That was fifty years ago, half of a hundred, and look how far we've come. I'm not saying we've done away with discrimination, but it's certainly been minimized since those times. If we can do something like that in fifty years, I have no problem believing the Vulcans can do it in 100. Remember IDIC. Yeah, I never saw the episode with IDIC in it... but, if that's something the Vulcans believe, than how can they go on with this discrimination? I'm sure that given a hundred years, they will realize that their attitude is sour. It probably won't even take that long. As for the disease aspect, a hundred years is a long time. I'm sure they've come up with a cure by Spock's time. I think the first episode in which Spock does the mind-meld is "Dagger of the Mind." In it, he tells Kirk that it is a very dangerous thing to do. So it is still dangerous. In fact, we see that in Voyager's "Meld." But it's probably safe to do with family and close friends. In "Flashback," a mind-meld helps the Doctor find what's wrong with Tuvok. And in "Endgame" (part II, I think), we learn that Tuvok has a disease that can only be cured by a mind-meld with a family member. The Vulcans are an accepting and logical people. It is no surprise that they are able to look past their initial qualms and embrace a thing that can be quite useful. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ezri Dax 0 Posted July 10, 2003 Well, I hope they explain this. Because I agree, 100 years isn't a lifetime for Vulcan, how can you explain mentality changing so fast. This could make a cool episode. I need to find a way to watch Enterprise!!! LOL Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
muddthe1st 0 Posted July 10, 2003 Well 100 years is a long time. Just look at the sexual revolution of our society in the past 40 years. Yeah, we have more casual and irresponsible views of sex and personal behavior than ever before. We must learn to govern our passions or it will be our undoing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpaceHippie 0 Posted July 11, 2003 Well 100 years is a long time. Just look at the sexual revolution of our society in the past 40 years. Yeah, we have more casual and irresponsible views of sex and personal behavior than ever before. We must learn to govern our passions or it will be our undoing. Lets Hear it for irresponsible sex! :biggrin: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dsbs 0 Posted July 18, 2003 It doesn't really seem all that unlikely to me...I mean, sometimes huge changes can take place really quickly, even though the struggle to get them there may take much longer. I mean, that the struggle can take ages, but the actual change may only take a few years. Like the Internet for example. Or different types of surgery. I dunno, but 100 years feels like a long time, to me... Except that after reading that 100 years isn't even a lifetime for a vulcan, it does seem a bit more unlikely... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
roguedawg 0 Posted August 4, 2003 Just another case of Enterprise's innumerable gaffs and unexplainable continuity flaws.Do the writers on Ent,or Berman and Braga even care what those stories are about? :blink: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theunicornhunter 2 Posted August 4, 2003 A lot can change in a hundred years - but you can't squeeze centuries of time honored traditions into a hundred years. TPTB messed up on this one - to me it's been their biggest gaffe. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VaBeachGuy 12 Posted September 13, 2005 I was just wondering if anyone else thought it was odd that in ENT the mind melds is seen as a perversion and a illness spreading practice, yet only 100 years later, in Spocks time is it well used among all, part of the marriage ritual, used to rejoin Spocks Katra with his body, used at the age of seven to bond a male child to his future wife etc. How could the transition so fast? opinions? 41804[/snapback] Knowing now what we know about the Vulcans of Enterprise it makes perfect sense. It just goes to show you that the writers and producers have a larger vision in mind and we as the audience should just sit back and watch how it unfolds. They'll make it all work out in the end. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kor37 9 Posted September 13, 2005 100 years ago in the American western frontier, a person who made a living gambling and pimping was considered a respectable businessman. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
