DS9 - Treatment in Syndication

[gul_nodrog 2]

I get so ticked off sometimes at how completely DS9 is ignored. You know, if DS9 had had more support from TPTB rather than being shoved to the side in favor of the lesser series called Voyager (now I liked Voyager, so don't start flaming me! DS9 was just better IMO), if DS9 had enjoyed the promotion that Voyager and TNG received, if they had put DS9 on a regular network (i.e. FOX not UPN) and aired it in a regular time slot and not on a modulation frequency that would have stumped the BORG ... then maybe one of the options to choose from for a new series would be any of the following:

 

1.) Sisko's return from the Celestial Temple. :P

 

2.) Bajor's struggle to become a member of the Federation ... finally.

 

3.) The rebuilding of Cardassia, which is in a shambles in the aftermath of the Dominion War.

 

4.) Can anyone say "What's going on with Odo in the Gamma Quadrant?" We spent enough time in the Delta Quadrant with Janeway and company. Frankly, I find the Gamma Quadrant much more interesting.

 

Klingons would be all right, BUT ONLY if we see Martok as the Chancellor. I would also want some reference to Worf's killing of Gowron, why Worf is no longer the ambassador to the Klingon Empire, and Worf's inclusion in the inner circle of Klingon politics due to his being a member of Martok's family.

 

Oh the "trials and tribbleations" of the beleaguered and ignored DS9 fan.

[Sam The Smuggler 1]

if they had put DS9 on a regular network (i.e. FOX not UPN) and aired it in a regular time slot and not on a modulation frequency that would have stumped the BORG

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I Got It On Fox...Usually 10 Or 11 At Night. Some Years On Mondays, Some Years On Fridays. It Was On Friday Night For A Long Time Here, Then Switched Back To Monday For Season 7

[Takara_Soong 4]

I get so ticked off sometimes at how completely DS9 is ignored.  You know, if DS9 had had more support from TPTB rather than being shoved to the side in favor of the lesser series called Voyager (now I liked Voyager, so don't start flaming me!  DS9 was just better IMO), if DS9 had enjoyed the promotion that Voyager and TNG received, if they had put DS9 on a regular network (i.e. FOX not UPN) and aired it in a regular time slot and not on a modulation frequency that would have stumped the BORG :blink: 

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DS9 was syndicated just like TNG was. Voyager's biggest problem was being on UPN. If you didn't get DS9 in a regular time slot weekly you should have complained to your local channel because that was their decision. TPTB had nothing to do with it.

 

I hate to burst everyone's bubble but there will NEVER be a DS9 movie. The ratings don't justify it, the DVD sales don't justify it. DS9 has been buried on Spike as morning programming. It lasted less than a month in prime time. In Canada, Space dropped it a few years ago because of low ratings. We get TOS, TNG and then Voyager in an afternoon package. DS9 DVD sales just were not very good.

 

As for Voyager, UPN promoted the series because it was considered the flagship series of the new network. It would have been much better off in syndication than on UPN IMO.

 

I also don't think there will ever be a Voyager movie. If you go up to the average person on the street, many will know who Picard, Data, Kirk and Spock are. If you asked these same people about Sisko, Quark, Janeway or Chakotay, you'll get blank looks. TOS was an iconic series. TNG was phenomenally successful ratings-wise. Neither DS9 nor Voyager have the following that TOS or TNG have. The suits at Paramount/Viacom will not make a movie if they think it won't make money and they have nothing (ie ratings, DVD sales) that tells them it will.

[gul_nodrog 2]

DS9 was syndicated just like TNG was. Voyager's biggest problem was being on UPN. If you didn't get DS9 in a regular time slot weekly you should have complained to your local channel because that was their decision. TPTB had nothing to do with it.

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Believe me, the local network heard from me weekly regarding the DS9 situation. You never knew what time it was going to air ... sometimes 10 p.m., sometimes 2 a.m., sometimes not at all. All I'm saying is that they never jerked TNG or Voyager around like that ... no wonder ratings were "low;" nobody knew when the dumb show was on!

 

I hate to burst everyone's bubble but there will NEVER be a DS9 movie. The ratings don't justify it, the DVD sales don't justify it. DS9 has been buried on Spike as morning programming. It lasted less than a month in prime time. In Canada, Space dropped it a few years ago because of low ratings. We get TOS, TNG and then Voyager in an afternoon package.  DS9 DVD sales just were not very good.

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You're not bursting my bubble ... nobody at Paramount cares about Niners and never did. :) I certainly have no hope of ever seeing a movie or series continuation of DS9. Nor would I really want to, it stands alone perfect as it is.

 

All I was saying is that it would just be nice, every ONCE in a while to have someone mention DS9 in some meaningless T.V. Guide poll, or to include key information from the series in the movies (i.e. Worf killing Gowron, becoming ambassador, marrying Jadzia, becoming part of Martok's family, Odo, Section 31, Bajor's status, Cardassia's status, the Gamma Quadrant). A lot of great things happened on that show and it really is a pity how it is completely ignored.

 

If you go up to the average person on the street, many will know who Picard, Data, Kirk and Spock are. If you asked these same people about Sisko, Quark, Janeway or Chakotay, you'll get blank looks.

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The average person on the street has a blank look on his or her face for just about every question you ask them. People are just plain dumb anymore. It's not my fault that they choose to wallow in the mediocrity of crap entertainment and miss out on a truly thought-provoking and well-acted series such as DS9.

[Takara_Soong 4]

Believe me, the local network heard from me weekly regarding the DS9 situation.  You never knew what time it was going to air ... sometimes 10 p.m., sometimes 2 a.m., sometimes not at all.  All I'm saying is that they never jerked TNG or Voyager around like that ... no wonder ratings were "low;" nobody knew when the dumb show was on!

 

All I was saying is that it would just be nice, every ONCE in a while to have someone mention DS9 in some meaningless T.V. Guide poll, or to include key information from the series in the movies (i.e. Worf killing Gowron, becoming ambassador, marrying Jadzia, becoming part of Martok's family, Odo, Section 31, Bajor's status, Cardassia's status, the Gamma Quadrant).  A lot of great things happened on that show and it really is a pity how it is completely ignored. 

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Paramount had no control over the time slots or pre-empting of DS9 because the series was syndicated. If DS9 was jerked around by your local channel then it was all the local channel's doing and had nothing to do with TPTB. You can't compare the treatment of DS9 and Voyager during original runs of the two series because DS9 was syndicated (sold to individual stations) and Voyager was network (UPN). UPN "suggested" when Voyager air to its affiliates and then the affiliates did what they want.

 

Many of the things you mention about Worf were not included in TNG movies because he was a secondary character and it didn't work its way into the plots of the movies. Worf's no longer being an ambassador was explained but cut in Nemesis. Obviously Voyager had no contact with the Alpha Quandrant for most of the run so most of what you mention could not be included. Enterprise did have an arc that included the forerunner of Starfleet's Section 31.

[Sam The Smuggler 1]

Believe me, the local network heard from me weekly regarding the DS9 situation.  You never knew what time it was going to air ... sometimes 10 p.m., sometimes 2 a.m., sometimes not at all.  All I'm saying is that they never jerked TNG or Voyager around like that ... no wonder ratings were "low;" nobody knew when the dumb show was on!

 

All I was saying is that it would just be nice, every ONCE in a while to have someone mention DS9 in some meaningless T.V. Guide poll, or to include key information from the series in the movies (i.e. Worf killing Gowron, becoming ambassador, marrying Jadzia, becoming part of Martok's family, Odo, Section 31, Bajor's status, Cardassia's status, the Gamma Quadrant).  A lot of great things happened on that show and it really is a pity how it is completely ignored. 

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Paramount had no control over the time slots or pre-empting of DS9 because the series was syndicated. If DS9 was jerked around by your local channel then it was all the local channel's doing and had nothing to do with TPTB. You can't compare the treatment of DS9 and Voyager during original runs of the two series because DS9 was syndicated (sold to individual stations) and Voyager was network (UPN). UPN "suggested" when Voyager air to its affiliates and then the affiliates did what they want.

 

Many of the things you mention about Worf were not included in TNG movies because he was a secondary character and it didn't work its way into the plots of the movies. Worf's no longer being an ambassador was explained but cut in Nemesis. Obviously Voyager had no contact with the Alpha Quandrant for most of the run so most of what you mention could not be included. Enterprise did have an arc that included the forerunner of Starfleet's Section 31.

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Hmmm...We Had Voyager Airing On One Of Our Other Local Channels Up Until Season 5. I Had To Wait Til We Got UPN To See Reruns Of Season 5 & 6. I Saw Season 7 When It Was New Though, Thankfully. Then After Enterprise Aird It's 3rd Week, We Lost UPN .....But Then Later...I Got UPN On Direct TV....Just Beofre "The Expanse" Aired.. :)

[gul_nodrog 2]

Paramount had no control over the time slots or pre-empting of DS9 because the series was syndicated. If DS9 was jerked around by your local channel then it was all the local channel's doing and had nothing to do with TPTB. You can't compare the treatment of DS9 and Voyager during original runs of the two series because DS9 was syndicated (sold to individual stations) and Voyager was network (UPN). UPN "suggested" when Voyager air to its affiliates and then the affiliates did what they want.

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Voyager was not immediatly on UPN because it aired locally on WB Channel 64. UPN came later, at least here in our area. And since we were dependent upon an independent station for Voyager and then it moved to another channel later -- the same exact thing happening to DS9 when it moved locally from FOX to CBS to UPN -- I can and will compare Voyager and DS9. I can only speak to what was happening in my viewing area.

 

I know this ... if I were a studio pouring big bucks into a costly television show such as a Trek series, I would be darn sure that the series at least aired regularly and wouldn't just shrug my shoulders when that wasn't happening. That's just dumb business ... pouring money down a rat hole. Just because that is the way things are apparently done, doesn't make those things sensible business.

 

Many of the things you mention about Worf were not included in TNG movies because he was a secondary character and it didn't work its way into the plots of the movies. Worf's no longer being an ambassador was explained but cut in Nemesis. Obviously Voyager had no contact with the Alpha Quandrant for most of the run so most of what you mention could not be included. Enterprise did have an arc that included the forerunner of Starfleet's Section 31.

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It wouldn't have taken much to have mentioned Worf's marriage in passing at the wedding of Riker/Troi. Just a line really.

 

I just get tired of DS9 being completely ignored and treated as if it never occured. I'm sure that all the Enterprise fans will feel the same way when that series is ignored in future Trek efforts.

[Takara_Soong 4]

Voyager was not immediatly on UPN because it aired locally on WB Channel 64.  UPN came later, at least here in our area.  And since we were dependent upon an independent station for Voyager and then it moved to another channel later -- the same exact thing happening to DS9 when it moved locally from FOX to CBS to UPN -- I can and will compare Voyager and DS9.  I can only speak to what was happening in my viewing area.

 

I know this ... if I were a studio pouring big bucks into a costly television show such as a Trek series, I would be darn sure that the series at least aired regularly and wouldn't just shrug my shoulders when that wasn't happening.  That's just dumb business ... pouring money down a rat hole.  Just because that is the way things are apparently done, doesn't make those things sensible business.

 

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I don't know how things worked for areas that didn't get UPN when Voyager came out but it sounds like it was syndicated into areas that UPN didn't reach.

 

You are missing my point though. You can't blame TPTB for when a syndicated program airs because they have NO CONTROL over the day or time the series is aired or whether the series is pre-empted. They sell the series to a station and that is how they make their money. The station makes the decision on when to air it.

 

I've split this from the original thread as it was off topic. I'm suffering from a lack of creativity so forgive me for the title of this thread.

[Theunicornhunter 2]

UPN & Syndication:

 

VOY was always a UPN program. It launched the premiere of the network. Some cities didn't have a UPN affiliate and for the first few years of VOY's run UPN would syndicate VOY to other stations - which means it would run whenever those stations wanted to show it. As Takara pointed out syndicated shows have no set schedule.

 

Then UPN got strict and wouldn't syndicate but demanded that a station carry it's entire programming in order to carry VOY. So my mom who lived in a small town got VOY several times because she was in more than one stations coverage but I lived in the state capital and couldn't get it at all. (although I did get a personal phone call from the cable company when they finally couldadd UPN to their line-up)In the US there are also laws about what cable networks have to carry and a UPN station went on the air within Tallahassee's "must carry" zone.

 

Currently where I live UPN programming is piggy-backed onto the FOX network. Primetime begins at 11:00 p.m. when FOX local affiliate news is over.

 

I agree that syndication would have been better for both VOY and ENT. As for Spike tv - it's not aiming for the "intellectual" crowd - I wish someone else had syndication rights to DS9.

[gul_nodrog 2]

I agree that syndication would have been better for both VOY and ENT.  As for Spike tv - it's not aiming for the "intellectual" crowd - I wish someone else had syndication rights to DS9.

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Spike TV certainly does cater to the lowest common denominator. Sci-Fi, USA, any other channel would be better.

 

Plus, what made DS9 different and perhaps harder to get into was the fact that you really couldn't just "jump right in" ... you had to watch every week to keep up with what was going on. Which made the constant shift in air times a huge hurdle for any fan to keep up with the story. Hence, "low" ratings ... what did they expect?

 

Whether Voyager was initially syndicated or not (as it was in my viewing area), it was aired on a fledgling network that was leaning heavily on it. Thus, DS9 gets shoved to the side having already been "sold" to all manner of television stations and Voyager enjoys much hype as the folks at Paramount try to push their UPN agenda. Again, I loved Voyager ... don't get me wrong. We had trouble "finding" its time slot from week to week sometimes as well. But missing an episode of Voyager was no big deal ... missing an episode of DS9 was critical as they were mostly part of a continuing story arc.

 

DS9 was just not for casual viewing, but apparently hit or miss, lackadaisical promotion is how you deal with a show like that. <_<

 

Do the execs at Paramount even have higher degrees in their fields? Or did they just find these people wandering the streets of L.A. and ask them if they wanted a job. Primary responsibilities: marketing and promotion of major television series. Job requirements: A pulse and willingness to behave as a "yes" man. :angry:

[VaBeachGuy 12]

I no longer have any faith in "TPTB" that are in charge of Trek. Star Trek, in it's history has had 3 "original" series. Of those 3, 2 of them were canceled and the other was basically ignored. The 3 that I speak of are TOS, DS9 and Enterprise. TNG had some "original" elements in it but it was basically TOS part 2 and Voyager was basically TNG part 2.

 

TOS, being the first was the original then after TNG had it's success they decided to come up with a new and original idea...

 

Put our heros on a fixed space station, let the adventures come to them and build story arcs that will paint a 7 year picture.

 

DS9 may have been based on Star Trek but it was truly original in all other ways. The same is true with Enterprise, it was based on Star Trek but since it pre-dated anything we'd seen so far they were free (to an extent) to build their history as they went along.

 

If "TPTB" wanted to increase Enterprises ratings they would have listened to Ira Steven Behr and brought him onboard. If they had the series would be preparing for season 5 right now.

 

As for Spike TV, it's great that they are airing TNG and DS9 but they butcher the episodes in favor of more commercials.

 

I have 0 faith in "ratings" and I have 0 faith in the network "brass".

[Itchygomba69 0]

since i work alot of evenings I love the Spike TV 4 hour block of trek, and I dont think the Spike TV Series are butchered as bad as TOS on SciFi is

[VaBeachGuy 12]

since i work alot of evenings I love the Spike TV 4 hour block of trek, and I dont think the Spike TV Series are butchered as bad as TOS on SciFi is

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That's true, pretty much all of the channels will butcher the episodes unless they are first run. It's just annoying.

[Itchygomba69 0]

yeah thanks god for DVD's

[Takara_Soong 4]

The fact that we all watch the episodes over and over again wouldn't have anything to do with it being so obvious, now would it. LOL

 

I remember watching Deja Q on Spike not too long ago and it was one of the scenes where Picard is talking to Q in the Brig. Q goes on about losing conscientiousness. They cut one of Picard's lines and it distracted me so much. I kept thinking "why did they cut out the captain saying "you get used to it"?" LOL

[VaBeachGuy 12]

The way I look at it is like if a book store were to edit 75 pages out of a book because they thought the author was using too much paper and they wanted to insert a few ads in place of the pages that were edited. It should be unacceptable for someone to alter a finished work.

[Itchygomba69 0]

but it does happen to every show, I'm ahuge simpsons fan and I notice itall the time how scences been cut, but my god what SciFi does to the TOS they should be ashamed of themselves, sometimes its hard to folow the story with all their commercials

[Stephen of Borg 2]

true, some lines may be taken out of the shows on Spike TV, but at least the plot is steal very clear