MoulinRouge

Disavowing it works for me. I loathed "These Are The Voyages." I think it's the most sorry excuse for a series finale they could have come up with. Total laziness. Total contempt. What good does it do to say TATV was the franchise finale, not ENT's finale, when TATV undid every good thing Manny accomplished this season? That's just spin.

It ruined everything. :( B) I wasted four seasons liking this show. Every letter I wrote to save it was a waste and I regret writing every single one of them. I regret I ever started watching. The bashers were right. Sooner or later, Berman and Braga will put their stamp on it, they said, and they were right. Archer's place in history was already marked by "In a Mirror Darkly" by being in the Defiant's history computer. I don't care if it gives fodder for the decanonise ENT crowd. Berman and Braga wrote one episode and cast a pall over everything. They even made Will and Deanna into contemptuous, condescending jerks.

Trip.

Endgame didn't get better with time. I'm sorry, but I think "These Are They Voyages" may have just buried Trek for a long time. It casts a pall over everything. That's not going to get better. The script disrespected every single character. I was bracing myself for it to be bad and I was still shocked.

Enterprise went out with a whimper. :blink:

i would have been sooooo content if terra prime was the last episode i ever saw of enterprise..

 

am i wrong in thinking that would have been an adequate finale?

No, you're not wrong. I'm just sick thinking about what an appropriate finale "Terra Prime" would have been for this cast of characters. :blink:

Why couldn't Berman and Braga have just left well enough alone? :) I am so mad at them. ENT could have gone out a winner with one spectacular finale season....but no. Of course not.

2/10. Terra Prime gets an "A"

"These Are the Voyages" gets a big fat "F."

Answering spoiler questions posed by Captain Picard:

WARNING!!! THE SPOILERS BELOW GIVE DETAILS OF THE NEXT EPISODE, "TERRA PRIME", AND ARE NOT PART OF THE DISCUSSION OF "DEMONS" !!!

Spoiler question #1-

Spoiler question #2

8 out of 10. It wasn't the adrenalin ride the past couple of weeks have been but I deeply respect what it was trying to do in paralleling real world events. I wish ENT had explored themes of prejudice just like this far more than they did for the past four years. ENT was the perfect setting for it. I'm wistful because this episode touches on how powerful ENT could have been under the right stewardship, with four years to explore these themes instead of two episodes.

It just seems subdued compared to the exhilarating treat we had the last two weeks with IamD.

9.5

A TOS fangirl's dream. It wasn't perfect, but I enjoyed this episode more than any other this season, and I've enjoyed the others quite a bit. Sorry, I like him usually but Bakula overacted. That's a shame. He just seemed a little much.

When they take her light out from under that bushel, Linda Park is prettier than Jolene Blalock. Amazing. Loved the Tholian/Defiant tie in. Clever.

WOW. I am highly disturbed about it since it should have offended my sensibilities, but MU Trip and T'Pol were hot....in a perverse and disturbed way, but hot nonetheless. :P They've got it going on in any universe. Also, is it my imagination, or did MU Trip seemed more bitter than just plain evil? The way he was leering at T'Pol whilst talking about "doing her a favor with her Pon Farr" was disturbingly wicked. Heh.

:( :)

A respectable 7 out of 10--light, frothy fun. Silly in many places but the fun dialogue made up for it. Camp in the best TOS tradition. As a woman, I can't seem to raise much "feminist ire" over it so to speak. They're sexy, slinky, green dancing girls. If you went in expecting a guilty pleasure episode you enjoyed it.

Take it in a TOS context.

The bits with Trip and T'Pol at the end were very cute.

MEG, the reviewer at Trek BBS, excoriated it. Blistering. I'm a feminist, too, but I think MEG didn't take it as the tongue in cheek episode it was intended to be. She ended the review saying she was "thankful that 'In a Mirror Darkly Part I' is pre-empted in her city next week" because she was so offended at the site of bare midriffed T'Pol in the preview and Trek always lessens women and so on and so forth. I tuned her out at that point. Even the best of sci-fi always has a bit of the sexy babe factor going on. I just can't get that upset over it at this point with cancellation looming, you know?

How altruistic of you. :angry: The "sinister six" are a group of immature children who are determined to prove that Tim Brazael is the anti-Christ. They "infiltrate the TU boards" posing as supporters, folks. Can you believe? What a joke that people expend that much negative energy.

Yes, the end of ENT does mean the end of Trek. ENT, this season, was wonderful. It's Rick and Brannon who screwed it up at the end.

Yes, it does sound like a disaster. In fact, Morpheus also used the adjective "appalling" to describe it. I'm not kidding. Morpheus used to make fun of us for prejudging episodes and he's using words like "appalling." He also called it a disaster. At this point, they'd be better off calling Bakula back into the studio to perform a two minute voice over "epilogue" and stick it on the end of the preceding episode. Something like "the federation was formed a few years later, after much heartache and sacrifice....etc. etc." Something similar. It might seem incomplete, but this finalé has the potential to turn ever dwindling numbers of trek fans off of Trek for good. I just can't get emotionally invested in Trek anymore. I'm not even angry at this point. I'm just numb. What is the point if the disaster twins can step in once and ruin everything? Berman is going to executive produce Trek XI about the Romulan wars with a brand new crew with no connection to anyone. I will not pay to see a Trek film with his name on it. Parmount is rewarding him for this. Braga has a new CBS series, "Threshold," Berman is still allowed to produce a Trek movie and Coto got the boot. This is crap.

Unfortunately it is not a rumor, Takara_Soong. :angry: You may recall me mentioning Morpheus, the insider at the TrekBBS who is rumored to be a script editor. Morpheus has not gotten a spoiler wrong in four years.

It is true.

Morpheus is on set. He says Braga was a little perturbed that fans have accused him of never taking a risk, so he wanted to do something daring for the finale. So this is what he chose. In the last fifteen minutes of the episode. According to Morpheus, this plot point was definitely Brannon Braga's idea. According to Morpheus, Rick and Brannon are quite taken aback by all the letters and phone calls Paramount has received to complain. They both thought this was a very daring idea. In fact, the episode was advertised as a "valentine to the fans" on Trek BBS. It never occurred to them that some fans might put a romantic connotation to "valentine" and assume that some culmination of Trip and T'Pol's relationship was involved. Rick and Brannon were under the impression that fans would be just thrilled to see

Bakulababe, this is particularly troublesome because

These spoilers were confirmed by Morpheus, by Quills, and by another insider on the TrekBBS. They are not rumors. According to Morpheus, another one of the script editors told Rick and Brannon to their faces, "this script smells of feces." The production crew is upset and offended and feel that it is an extremely poor send off for the series. It's a "valentine" for us. This is the last episode of Trek for maybe forever. It is a disaster that could only be fixed by another season or a television movie. Manny Coto did a print interview at saveenterprise.com on February 25. This was not his plan for a season five had he gotten one. He certainly didn't plan on you know who taking a dirt nap. Rick and Brannon insisted on writing the last episode....actually according to Trektoday the script was written for last year had ENT been cancelled. Rick and Brannon decreed that it would be used. They wouldn't let Manny write it. Something is wrong here, folks. This is a disaster.

Mr. David Stapf

President

Paramount Television

5555 Melrose Avenue

Los Angeles, CA 90038-3112

That is the only man who can give the okay for another network to produce ENT. Spike has shown interest according to the Boston Herald. Spike has the money since they cancelled their contract with WWE. Spike has $40 million dollars. Spike is looking for new orginal programming. Spike asked, and so far Stapf has said "no." In the article, Jolene said that the cast (with the exception of Linda Park) would love to come back. Technically, they aren't released from their contracts until August. I have written him a letter. If a second modern Trek series ends in disaster that's it kids. People loathed "Endgame" for Voyager. Morpheus says this is much, much worse, that it's an insult to the fans who stuck in there. Trek can't afford to have another series end on a sour note. The franchise isn't healthy enough. This is supposed to be Trek history, the way it all ties together. If this is botched, it is far more damaging to the franchise than a series about a starship lost in the Delta quadrant ending on a bad note. Voyager was an adjunct to Trek history. Enterprise is its beginning. It's a pity, because according to Morpheus the five episodes preceding the finale range from "very good" to "fantastic." Only the finale is a bomb.

During business hours at Paramount (US Pacific time) there is a number with a voice menu. At the prompt you can ask for "Richard (not Rick) Berman," "Brannon Braga" and I believe "David Stapf" may have been added. My husband called and talked to Berman's assistant.

Parmount's phone # 323-956-5000

Paramount fax # 323-862-1134 (just add the US country code from overseas)

The finalé was NOT written by Manny Coto. It is the only episode all season written by Rick Berman and Brannon Braga. It is their idea.

Big shock, huh? :) It's so incredible that they actually have negated my positive feelings about the $3 million donation received today by Save Enterprise. Quills has been a 100 percent accurate spoiler source, nerd359. Unfortanately the spoiler you cited above is true. In the finalé

They've ruined everything. Manny Coto stated in his interview at Saveenterprise that he had plans to keep the Trip/T'Pol storyline going in season five and all sorts of other plans. This particular plot point was NOT Manny's idea whatsoever. I've talked to people at the rally. Manny pretty much said straight out that the season finalé of season four would not influence his plans for writing season five if they were lucky enough to get one. They didn't understand why he was being so cryptic, but now they do. Basically he was saying that he would undo this. They didn't get the script until late last week. Nobody knew.

Quills also said that the writing staff and production crew are pretty upset; they've voiced their opinion that this is an awful way to end the series.

I agree. Pardon my french but this is one big (I'm trying to say a bad word but can't) YOU to the loyal fans. Berman is interested in his movie with a new crew. I've got to hand it to him.

I gave this one an eight. Rollicking good fun and entertaining, but not quite as good as last week in my opinion. I agree that this line

I gave a 9 and a 9.5 the last two weeks but I can only give this one a 7.5. I enjoyed it. Don't get me wrong, but it felt oddly disjointed from the rest of the arc. Shran was terrific as always, and

Now the ratings pop back up. Now. :P I thought I'd missed Sci-fi wire's weekly gloating about how well Stargate and Battlestar Galactica had done in the ratings compared to ENT. Now wonder since ENT bested SG-1 by half a million viewers this last week. These are the finals, not the fast nationals which aren't every market.

From Cyrus at TrekBBS.

Aenar Final rating

3.17 million viewers. Better than Veronica Mars at 2.97 million and Kevin Hill at 1.9 million. Isn't that ironic? :huh: I don't know whether to cry or to laugh.

Folks, that sci-fi address with Bonnie Hammer is the one to hit and hit hard. Immediately. It's the only chance of seeing the show next year. It's not a guarantee by any stretch but there is zero chance of seeing it on UPN.

An important point to make is that you wouldn't mind the budget cut per episode if Manny Coto and the current creative team are brought on board. That's more important than anything.

A 9.5

I am so sad that this show is going off the air. Is it just me, or do Connor and Dominic have the most refreshing "friendship" type chemistry going on since Bashir and O'Brien on DS9? It's so cool that they're best friends in real life. My friends heard Dom say so at one of the cons. It's easy to believe. They are so gosh darned cute together.

I signed.

I'm not offended by what the King said either. He has a right to his opinion. I'm certainly not put off by someone who is of the opinion that the volume is too loud or who doesn't prefer the song. Please make no mistake about that whomever made that comment. I'm not upset about it.

However, I've posted this video in several places because I was so proud of my friend's work and to date this is the only forum where the words "horrible" and "disgusting" were levied. Too people who love each other? That's disgusting? Trek should steer clear? Why? How sad that people find that disgusting.

What has happened to Trek fans? I missed the edict that Trek was supposed to be G rated entertainment. This is PG at best. There is a reason that other science fiction is leaving Trek behind and it isn't only the showing of skin. Trek needs to catch up with the times and in more than superficial ways. John Billingsley was right in that latest inteview of his. ENT didn't go nearly far enough in depicting real human flaws as opposed to cosmetic on the surface flaws.

Perhaps Hoshissis should have cropped the tiny hint of behind, but the girl is English and she's flabbergasted at American responses to certain things. It's just not that way in the UK. I promise you it didn't even occur to her that it would be perceived as digusting. That shower scene shows nothing naughty. She was just trying to put in scenes that relayed the passionate feeling of the music and of the two characters for each other. It was called "the best I've ever seen" elsewhere. "Beautiful," "passionate," "a more classy take on the couple than the show gave them in season three." I did not predict that anyone would find it disgusting. Believe me, I didn't. I'm sorry. I just wanted to share it.

Mods, would you please delete the thread? Obviously it will cause problems. I definitely regret posting it here. This will be my last post in this forum so that I won't cause any more problems.

What does it tell me? Well, that's more a figure of speech, but it tells me you consider science fiction or Trek somehow "sacred" and that it shouldn't be sullied by romance and other assorted sensitive "girly" type things from your point of view. Your reaction wasn't so much objective dislike of the video as much as a hostile reaction to a depiction of romance in Trek.

To each his own.

Gosh, The King, I'm sorry you feel that way. We're all entitled to our opinion. I'm thinking that it took a storyline that wasn't handled in the best way from the beginning and presented it in an extremely classy way. Star Trek was initially about exploring the human condition through outer space allegory. I can't fathom what is so "horrible" about two beings having feelings for each other. How sad that you feel that way. :lol: It's very telling. If you didn't like the editing or the song it would have been more understandable. The first two people to break the human/Vulcan barrier is more than a little applicable to Trek history.

C'est la vie. To each his own. I'm glad you enjoyed it, BakulaBabe. :lol:

Hosshissis from HoT made it and edited it so beautifully. I've been begging someone to put Trip and T'Pol to my favorite song in the entire world--Knights in White Satin--and she had done it masterfully, tastefully, and beautifully. It's movie quality. Paramount could have used this to market. I'm not kidding. It's that good. Better than anything UPN ever came up with, to be certain. Check it out. You can right click and save. :lol:

self aggrandisement the slow shot of him caressing her ears with his fingertips in that infamous first decon scene was mine. :lol: Hoshissis incorporated it into classic form.

Knights in White Satin

A 9.5

I was seriously very impressed with this episode.

Thank you, good people. B)

Thanks, folks. It's much appreciated. I just hope that we can get the ad in USA Today in time.