Blueicus 0 Posted May 22, 2003 If I recall correctly, in only two situations did Voyager actually kick full-powered Borg butt. The first incident was against the tiny probe ship and the second one was when Voyager was refitted with futuristic Transphasic torpedoes and Ablative armour. In the other incidents Voyager used less direct methods of evading/defeating the collective. Don't forget that in TNG, that first episode with Hugh, the Admiral suggested implanting an algorithm in Hugh that would disrupt the entire collective. That would've dealt an even bigger blow than blowing up some puny transwarp hub. Of course, eventually the sharing of Hugh's individuality only wreaked havoc on that one cube, as opposed to affecting the entire borg collective. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ddillard 2 Posted May 23, 2003 If I recall correctly, in only two situations did Voyager actually kick full-powered Borg butt. The first incident was against the tiny probe ship and the second one was when Voyager was refitted with futuristic Transphasic torpedoes and Ablative armour. In the other incidents Voyager used less direct methods of evading/defeating the collective. Don't forget that in TNG, that first episode with Hugh, the Admiral suggested implanting an algorithm in Hugh that would disrupt the entire collective. That would've dealt an even bigger blow than blowing up some puny transwarp hub. Of course, eventually the sharing of Hugh's individuality only wreaked havoc on that one cube, as opposed to affecting the entire borg collective. I have always wondered why the effect was contained to the one cube, or was it? Maybe that had some effect on the creation of Unimatrix 0. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdigs 0 Posted May 26, 2003 If anything the other series have given the Borg more depth, then just being baddies for Picard and crew. They tried to make them less scary with ep's like Hugh, but then only had him get angry for detaching him from the collective. I loved Janeway's battle with the Queen and despite trepidation actually enjoyed the Borg's apperance on Ent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ddillard 2 Posted May 26, 2003 If anything the other series have given the Borg more depth, then just being baddies for Picard and crew. They tried to make them less scary with ep's like Hugh, but then only had him get angry for detaching him from the collective. I loved Janeway's battle with the Queen and despite trepidation actually enjoyed the Borg's apperance on Ent. I agree. IMHO a villain is more believable if the characters have been given some depth so that the audience can understand and see their objectives. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gdog243 0 Posted May 26, 2003 If anything the other series have given the Borg more depth, then just being baddies for Picard and crew. They tried to make them less scary with ep's like Hugh, but then only had him get angry for detaching him from the collective. I loved Janeway's battle with the Queen and despite trepidation actually enjoyed the Borg's apperance on Ent. But wouldn't that take away from why the borg were created in the first place. They were there as kind of monsters who couldn't be reasoned with. They were supposed to be nightmarish, at least at first. I agree that it was good to give them more of a 3-demensional attitude to villanous, but I think with voyager (Espesscially Dark Frontier) they went over the top. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ddillard 2 Posted May 27, 2003 If anything the other series have given the Borg more depth, then just being baddies for Picard and crew. They tried to make them less scary with ep's like Hugh, but then only had him get angry for detaching him from the collective. I loved Janeway's battle with the Queen and despite trepidation actually enjoyed the Borg's apperance on Ent. But wouldn't that take away from why the borg were created in the first place. They were there as kind of monsters who couldn't be reasoned with. They were supposed to be nightmarish, at least at first. I agree that it was good to give them more of a 3-demensional attitude to villanous, but I think with voyager (Espesscially Dark Frontier) they went over the top. I have always found villains to be scarier after you know a little bit more about them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdigs 0 Posted May 27, 2003 If anything the other series have given the Borg more depth, then just being baddies for Picard and crew. They tried to make them less scary with ep's like Hugh, but then only had him get angry for detaching him from the collective. I loved Janeway's battle with the Queen and despite trepidation actually enjoyed the Borg's apperance on Ent. But wouldn't that take away from why the borg were created in the first place. They were there as kind of monsters who couldn't be reasoned with. They were supposed to be nightmarish, at least at first. I agree that it was good to give them more of a 3-demensional attitude to villanous, but I think with voyager (Espesscially Dark Frontier) they went over the top. Good point. But when you know just how nightmarish they really are, dosen't that make them all the more scary? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ddillard 2 Posted May 27, 2003 If anything the other series have given the Borg more depth, then just being baddies for Picard and crew. They tried to make them less scary with ep's like Hugh, but then only had him get angry for detaching him from the collective. I loved Janeway's battle with the Queen and despite trepidation actually enjoyed the Borg's apperance on Ent. But wouldn't that take away from why the borg were created in the first place. They were there as kind of monsters who couldn't be reasoned with. They were supposed to be nightmarish, at least at first. I agree that it was good to give them more of a 3-demensional attitude to villanous, but I think with voyager (Espesscially Dark Frontier) they went over the top. Good point. But when you know just how nightmarish they really are, dosen't that make them all the more scary? Finally someone found the words that I was looking for. That is what I had been trying to get across, but apparently it was not coming out right. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob 0 Posted May 29, 2003 I always saw The Borg as tough, ruthless B@$T@**$ (and i mean that in a good way B) ) untill Voyager and the whole 8472 deal came along, then they were made to look like Wimps, wich wasnt cool!!!! :) B) :) Voyager ruined The Borg, sorry, but thats how I feel. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
commander_data 0 Posted May 29, 2003 The first ST movie I saw was "First Contact". It gave me my first sight of the Borg and I have to say, it frightened me the way they kept adapting to everything. I think that VOY basically killed the Borg's image. TNG portrayed them as ruthless savages (whoa, flashback from English...never mind) but VOY pretty much said that a flagship with limited weapons could beat a race that can adapt within three shots of a phaser. VOY also seemed to forget the way they adapted. All in all, my opinion of the Borg never changed. I still think they're creepy, evil, and savage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Data 0 Posted May 29, 2003 No, my opinion of the Borg has not changed. RESITANCE IS FUTILE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
commander_data 0 Posted May 29, 2003 ...Not what I would expect from an android... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yillara Skye 1 Posted May 30, 2003 Hey, no picking on him... Since I am a TNG fan I will reiterate my opinion, I believe that my opinion of the Borg has not changed in the slightest. And I do tend to refer to the Borg Queen as the MegaB**ch, OK personal opinion there! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
commander_data 0 Posted May 30, 2003 Again, not whaty I would expect from an android! Or at least an android fan...ah, forget it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yillara Skye 1 Posted May 31, 2003 Again, not whaty I would expect from an android! Or at least an android fan...ah, forget it... What about the fact that our opinion of the Borg has not changed???? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
