Has your Opinions of the Borg been changed...

[gdog243 0]

After watching TNG's most frightening and dangorous enemy get wussified by VOY and ENT, (Fans of both shows, this is no intention of a bash) when you watch a borg episode of TNG such as "Best of Both Worlds" or "Q Who?" has your opinion of them changed. What I mean is when TNG first aired, the borg were scary, dangerous and basically a race not to deal with. However, because you know more about them and they have basically been used as a plot gimmick, does that nulify the impact they have on you when watching TNG?

 

For me, I try to forget that the borg have been wussified and still enjoy what the borg brought to TNG. Heck, last night I tried to watch "Regeneration" from the Point of Veiw of Archer and the rest of the crew. It was hard to spot, but I saw some TNG borg last night, even though I question why it takes so long to adapt to phase pistles at high power when phasers (Which should be more advanced) at normal power doesn't scratch.

 

So, has your opinion of TNG's borg changed or do you look at them as the cowards they are being portrayed as now?

[ddillard 2]

I have never seen the Borg as cowards. I think that the changes that we have seen are the Borg "adapting" to an enemy that is more formidable than they had anticipated.

[Takara_Soong 4]

I think Enterprise did a lot to bring the Borg back to being that menacing presence that they were in TNG. They were scary again!!

[Gotabite 0]

I will always view the Borg as a force to rekon with. They always find a way to adapt. Even in the final episode of Voyager. I was left believing that somehow that was not the end of the Borg........the Queen and her drones would be heard from again.

[~Crims~ 0]

I will always view the Borg as a force to rekon with.  They always find a way to adapt.  Even in the final episode of Voyager. I was left believing that somehow that was not the end of the Borg........the Queen and her drones would be heard from again.

I agree. I personally disagree with the statement that the borg were wussified. Lets be realistic, after so many encounters the Federation starts to become used to him. They developed weapons and strategies specifically to battle the Borg. So it makes sense they aren't as dangerous. While any given crew will probably have fear when encountering the Borg, you can't compare the first two encounters, when you know very little, to the 20th encounter when you know a lot. The crew isn't going to have the same feelings at that point and thus, either would the audience. With ENT, because the Borg were "new" again, the crew felt the same fear and wonder that the TNG crew originally felt and because of this, most members of the audience felt the same way, at least I did.

[A l t e r E g o 9]

I understand what you are saying gdog243 and it’s true, VOY did wussify the Borg but when I asked myself if the terror of them should not have been diminished, the answer seems to detract from the Optimistic Promise of the Future which is the cornerstone of Trek.

 

Wussifing them was what happened but the reason was to show Mankind will learn to adapt to whatever obstacles the future holds in store.

 

I think this is the way tptb think about it;

Scenario 1. The Queen up’s the stakes and deals Humanity a devastating blow. The trouble with that; She could finally win, (or cause so much damage we could be set back 100s of years), that could be very realistic but if that happened, what would the point of all which came before, where would the Saga go from there?

 

Scenario 2. Janeway kicked her rear-end back to the stone-age (ok, we know that did not happen but) She is doing some serious wound licking and deciding (?) to leave the humans alone.

 

In Scenario 2, The Future Continues…

[Sam The Smuggler 1]

To me...The Borg will always be just as Dangerous. Sure you can find ways to beat them, but They Just Keep Coming...and coming...and coming.

 

I Think that "Wussified" is and unfair way to describe. Finding weaknesses doesn't....wussify something. Maybe is some 24th Century Timeline Borh Story, The Borg will be on the brink of winning...and then Starfleet or whoever will Win...but just barely....maybe.

 

Q did afterall introduce the Federation to the Borg to prepare them for future Borg Encounters. Maybe they stuck with that

 

Anyways...I'm convinced that the Borg will one day Control The Entire Galaxay in Star Trek

[deagletime 1]

well i think the phaser thing has to do with the amount of drones working on adapting the phasers.... i think it all depends on the resources available toward solving a problem.... a standard sphere would have say thousands... the "mini" collective of the alpha quadrant was like 10? i can recal a line from endgame where admiral janeway says "shes got the whole collective working on adapting to our weapons"

 

anyhow getting back on track...i agree that the more we see the borg, the more confident we are that they can be defeated....i remeber after the bestofbothworlds, i was thinkign that federation was screwed...if a single cube could destroy most of the ffederation fleet, then a small group of cubes could level the entire dominion, cardassian and romulan armada ... but after janeway has outwitted the queen numerous times, its like goliath can be defeated by little old voyager

[Stelfan 0]

I think they did a great job in Regeneration, the borgs were really scary.. However, Voyager almost destroyed them in their episodes, they were real wussies..

[ensign_beedrill 0]

I do not think that the Borg have been "wussified." They always scare me when I see them. They are always adapting, always getting better. You think you finally have the technology to beat them and BAM! they come out with something more sophisticated. Every time a ship encounters the Borg, they have a tough battle. And at some points, it seems that it might be impossible to get out of such a fix. It's hard to defeat the Borg, and it shows in each episode dealing with them. The ship barely gets away, and usually they have to conduct extensive repairs. The Borg will always be formidable foes. They will never lose their intimidation factor. At least not for me. I'm always at the edge of my seat when I see them.

[dsbs 0]

I do not think that the Borg have been "wussified."  They always scare me when I see them.  They are always adapting, always getting better.  You think you finally have the technology to beat them and BAM! they come out with something more sophisticated.  Every time a ship encounters the Borg, they have a tough battle.  And at some points, it seems that it might be impossible to get out of such a fix.  It's hard to defeat the Borg, and it shows in each episode dealing with them.  The ship barely gets away, and usually they have to conduct extensive repairs.  The Borg will always be formidable foes.  They will never lose their intimidation factor.  At least not for me.  I'm always at the edge of my seat when I see them.

Exactly! When I really get into the episode, seeing them can get me into a panic! It's like a box closing over you - there's NOTHING you can do! Theere are so many, and they keep on adapting! I think they were and are a great star trek enemy!!

[Yillara Skye 1]

Since I have never seen them in any series other than TNG or First Contact, since I ONLY watch TNG...I can't say my opinion has changed. I have heard a lot of talk about them being turned into complete wusses. I think the Borg are excellent enemies! And I have a former teammate of mine that would tell you that they are quite scary to her! My friend and I brought First Contact to a gym sleepover(all but two or three were under 8 years old, and we had a rating max of PG-13)....BIG MISTAKE, we discovered that one of the older kids was terrified of the Borg, they actually gave her severe nightmares. We found her hiding curled in a ball under the trampoline, she was crying hysterically, and she also was hiding so the other girls would not see her and pick on her for her fear.

[ensign_beedrill 0]

Yeah, dsbs, when I really get into an episode, I have to wonder if they're going to make it out of this one. It always seems they find an answer at the last possible moment. And they keep coming back. You defeat them, but they keep coming back. And stonger than before.

 

Since I have never seen them in any series other than TNG or First Contact, since I ONLY watch TNG...

 

Only TNG? Aw... try catching some of the others when they're on TV some time. They're pretty good. I can't say much for DS9 because I haven't seen very many episodes. (It doesn't air where I live.) Though the ones I have seen have been entertaining. I wish I could see more. T.T But I've seen lots of the others and they are really good. Plus, it's really cool when they cross over the series. Riker was on Voyager once. ^-^;; And B'Elanna was talking about Data one time.

[Yillara Skye 1]

Yeah, dsbs, when I really get into an episode, I have to wonder if they're going to make it out of this one.  It always seems they find an answer at the last possible moment.  And they keep coming back.  You defeat them, but they keep coming back.  And stonger than before.

 

Since I have never seen them in any series other than TNG or First Contact, since I ONLY watch TNG...

 

Only TNG? Aw... try catching some of the others when they're on TV some time. They're pretty good. I can't say much for DS9 because I haven't seen very many episodes. (It doesn't air where I live.) Though the ones I have seen have been entertaining. I wish I could see more. T.T But I've seen lots of the others and they are really good. Plus, it's really cool when they cross over the series. Riker was on Voyager once. ^-^;; And B'Elanna was talking about Data one time.

Actually I have caught at least 3 episodes of each of the other series...but none appeal to me as much as TNG...That series took 10 minutes tops and I was hooked!

 

Other TV shows took me a few watchings before I really began to get into them....XFiles for one...

[Sam The Smuggler 1]

and speaking of Borg and other shows, the only time the ever appeard on DS9 was in the Pilot, in a Flashback Scene of the Wolf 359 Battle...made for that episode infact...

[dsbs 0]

Yeah, dsbs, when I really get into an episode, I have to wonder if they're going to make it out of this one.  It always seems they find an answer at the last possible moment.  And they keep coming back.  You defeat them, but they keep coming back.  And stonger than before.

 

Since I have never seen them in any series other than TNG or First Contact, since I ONLY watch TNG...

 

Only TNG? Aw... try catching some of the others when they're on TV some time. They're pretty good. I can't say much for DS9 because I haven't seen very many episodes. (It doesn't air where I live.) Though the ones I have seen have been entertaining. I wish I could see more. T.T But I've seen lots of the others and they are really good. Plus, it's really cool when they cross over the series. Riker was on Voyager once. ^-^;; And B'Elanna was talking about Data one time.

ooh, I have to hear that - was it a good thing or what (about Data...)

 

I know Barclay and Troi were also on VOY, and "Thomas" (who was played by Jonathan Frakes) was on DS9.

[Yillara Skye 1]

Yeah, dsbs, when I really get into an episode, I have to wonder if they're going to make it out of this one.  It always seems they find an answer at the last possible moment.  And they keep coming back.  You defeat them, but they keep coming back.  And stonger than before.

 

Since I have never seen them in any series other than TNG or First Contact, since I ONLY watch TNG...

 

Only TNG? Aw... try catching some of the others when they're on TV some time. They're pretty good. I can't say much for DS9 because I haven't seen very many episodes. (It doesn't air where I live.) Though the ones I have seen have been entertaining. I wish I could see more. T.T But I've seen lots of the others and they are really good. Plus, it's really cool when they cross over the series. Riker was on Voyager once. ^-^;; And B'Elanna was talking about Data one time.

ooh, I have to hear that - was it a good thing or what (about Data...)

 

I know Barclay and Troi were also on VOY, and "Thomas" (who was played by Jonathan Frakes) was on DS9.

I agree, I wanna know, what did B'Elanna say about him???

[Sam The Smuggler 1]

She was talking to Androids found in the Delta Quadrent. She mentioned Data being Treated as Person and not a Tool like the ones they found. I think that was it

[ddillard 2]

Yeah, dsbs, when I really get into an episode, I have to wonder if they're going to make it out of this one.  It always seems they find an answer at the last possible moment.  And they keep coming back.  You defeat them, but they keep coming back.  And stonger than before.

 

Since I have never seen them in any series other than TNG or First Contact, since I ONLY watch TNG...

 

Only TNG? Aw... try catching some of the others when they're on TV some time. They're pretty good. I can't say much for DS9 because I haven't seen very many episodes. (It doesn't air where I live.) Though the ones I have seen have been entertaining. I wish I could see more. T.T But I've seen lots of the others and they are really good. Plus, it's really cool when they cross over the series. Riker was on Voyager once. ^-^;; And B'Elanna was talking about Data one time.

ooh, I have to hear that - was it a good thing or what (about Data...)

 

I know Barclay and Troi were also on VOY, and "Thomas" (who was played by Jonathan Frakes) was on DS9.

I agree, I wanna know, what did B'Elanna say about him???

I don't remember that, what episode was it in, and what did she say?

[Yillara Skye 1]

She was talking to Androids found in the Delta Quadrent. She mentioned Data being Treated as Person and not a Tool like the ones they found. I think that was it

 

B'Elanna is right....

[cptwright 1]

I think they did a great job in Regeneration, the borgs were really scary.. However, Voyager almost destroyed them in their episodes, they were real wussies.. 

well along that line of thinking what about first contact, everyone was losing their butts, till enterprise showed up, boom, suddenly they destroyed the cube without a scratch and followed the sphere into the past. its a show, its a script someone wrote to entertain. you cant have voyager face the borg, and get blown outta space, that would end the show. same with first contact, your supposed to feel that the enterprise is sooo much better, because of the blend of her crew and the ship, but in the end, no matter how scary you make them, their going to lose, so the show can go on. inevidebly after the first couple a times seeing them, your going to start getting the feeling of oh, they'll just beat them again, its part of the show. but its still none the less entertaining, i enjoyed regeneration, i loved FC, FC was and is my favorite TNG movie. so i think they did a good job writing the script, shooting the movie. the borg add an entertainment value most people like, so they'll be around the startrek universe forever, maybe not anymore in enterprise, but in movies or future series im sure.IMHO

[ensign_beedrill 0]

ooh, I have to hear that - was it a good thing or what (about Data...)

Oh yeah, it was a good thing. It was in the episode called "Prototype." She finds a robot. And this type of robot was used by their creators for working and such things. And B'Elanna told him that where they come from, they treat everyone equally. That there was an anroid much like him on another ship who was treated the same as everyone else. The robot asked what his name was and she said that it was Data.

[dsbs 0]

You have made my day, ensign_beedrill! (thats quite sad, isn't it )

[Yillara Skye 1]

You have made my day, ensign_beedrill! (thats quite sad, isn't it )

I agree dsbs, definately made my day! I had seen someone else post something similar, but no matter what it was still grat to hear that!

[prometheus 0]

Ive said it before and i'll say it again. In Voyager The Borg Queen and Janeway were like Lydia and Dianna in V. Always hissing at each other and being really b1tchy to each other. This was more like Dynasty than serious Sci Fi. I think the Borg became domesticated with characters like Seven and One and the Borg Kids. I mean Voyager had a Borg version of the Waltons living in a cargo bay. Goodnight Icheb-boyyyy!! I have yet to see Regeneration as I live in the backward wasteland that is Ireland but it'll be on in a few weeks time on cable (yes! we do have it!) and I will then be in a better position to see if Enterprise has made them a menace again. I dont want to see them become regular characters in Enterprise though.

[Yillara Skye 1]

Ive said it before and i'll say it again. In Voyager The Borg Queen and Janeway were like Lydia and Dianna in V. Always hissing at each other and being really b1tchy to each other. This was more like Dynasty than serious Sci Fi. I think the Borg became domesticated with characters like Seven and One and the Borg Kids. I mean Voyager had a Borg version of the Waltons living in a cargo bay. Goodnight Icheb-boyyyy!! I have yet to see Regeneration as I live in the backward wasteland that is Ireland but it'll be on in a few weeks time on cable (yes! we do have it!) and I will then be in a better position to see if Enterprise has made them a menace again. I dont want to see them become regular characters in Enterprise though.

The borgtons....that is funny(Borg+Waltons), I can see your point they (on Voyager, from what I have been reading) have domesticated the Borg too much....

[ensign_beedrill 0]

You have made my day, ensign_beedrill! (thats quite sad, isn't it :P)

Not sad at all. ^-^;; It made my day when I heard it.

[dsbs 0]

You have made my day, ensign_beedrill! (thats quite sad, isn't it )

Not sad at all. ^-^;; It made my day when I heard it.

I'm glad to hear it, and glad I returned the favour!

[KayTroi 0]

The Borg are nothing to play with. Take it from Q " Do not mess with the Borg". Even Q knows when to step aside and let others pass. The Borg are a force not to be reckoned with.

[A l t e r E g o 9]

Well I don't know about all of that after the SPANKING Janeway gave them. Perhaps they (She) are preparing for a visit to the Alpha Quadrant again...