Dark Reality

You mean in the Predator films, the species is named Yajuta? I mean that the Nausicaans are based on the Predator... or Yajutas (Yajutae?) if that's what they technically are.

I don't know if Trek based anything on the Aliens (xenomorphs), but Nintendo did. When they couldn't get the rights to make an Aliens video game, they made Metroid. The Metroids are nothing like the Aliens, but it's a very similar idea: Female bounty hunter/warrior type goes to planet to fight aliens.

I actually have the directors cuts of Independence Day and Blade Runner. I have never seen Blade Runner all the way through, though I intend to, as my girlfriend hasn't seen it. I love Total Recall, which she saw for the first time with me last week or the week before, and liked it... and they're both based on stories by... Phillip P. Richard, is that it? The same guy has a new movie coming out, "A Scanner Darkly", but this one is animated... looks quite good.

ID4:DC had more Okun (Brent Spiner)? I remember a few added shots, but I don't recall any new Okun scenes. Maybe one was simply extended, a few new lines added, and I didn't notice. I loved ID4, saw it twice in the theaters, bought the VHS the day it came out (yep, got the holographic cover and the matted lithograph of the ship above NYC), but I left the VHS in California.

I don't own multiple versions of any movie but Donnie Darko. And that's because I prefer the theatrical edition. I'm considering giving away the directors cut, but I'll probably keep it out of respect. It's easily the best movie I've ever seen, and though I have a preference, it's cool having two versions of it. If I were to get a directors cut of a movie I already have, I'd give away the original - this happened with Lord of the Rings 1 (my girlfriend's sister got that) and Robin Hood - I actually haven't got the DC yet, but when I moved, I left the original. I didn't mention it above, but the original Robin Hood was two-sided; you had to flip the disc halfway through (around the bathing scene). A member on my board said that the DC has the movie all on one disc.

I've seen the directors cut of Aliens... I want that. I don't remember the original much. Of all the Aliens movies, the second one is the only one which interested me, and I liked seeing the longer cut.

I forgot to mention them, but the best directors cuts may be of the Lord of the Rings movies. I don't consider their extended edition releases done to capitalize off DVD sales; rather, the movies were intended to be that long, but they had to cut them for the theaters. Really, I don't think they should have, and just had the movies have an intermission. Hey, it worked for Schindler's List!

Wow. Twisted Pictures was really doing some amazing stuff. I hope they are able to continue. Their films may not be for everyone, but I think they've rejuvenated the horror genre.

Dying of natural causes is not the same as dying of old age. It just means you weren't killed by another person or a disease. It's rare, but teenagers can get heart attacks - people in their 20s certainly can. Neck pain? I can't think of anything, but the "natural causes" bit doesn't surprise me. Also it's a broad statement when they don't want to announce the specifc thing that killed him (either they don't know yet (autopsy pending), or aren't saying).

However it is sad that one should die so young. My father was 53 when he passed away, and he wasn't young per se, but a person should live at least 65 years. Anything before that, and I say they passed too soon.

Not in the first episode, and that's all I watched of ENT. I fully plan to give it another shot, just as soon as I get high-speed Internet back. I figure ENT ought to be quicker to get being that it's newer than DS9, Voyager, and Next Generation, and I got those easily enough. Actually it's the NX-01's exterior design, mirror episodes, and Vulcans that has me curious, but to hear there are good time-travel episodes is icing on the cake.

Another Trek film that gets a lot of grief from the fans, I've noticed, is Star Trek IX: Insurrection. Personally, I love this movie. Of all the Trek films, I've seen it more than the others. And I would have to say it's my favorite TNG film. No contest. I even prefer it to First Contact - great movie, easily second among the TNG movies. A discussion about bad things about Insurrection popped up in another thread, which led me to want to defend it in a topic of its own.

One "complaint" which popped up a couple times was the issue of the joystick, when Riker takes "manual control" of the Enterprise. I thought this was very cool, actually, and I still think it's cool every time. It's an ego trip is what it is, nothing more, nothing less. The Enterprise and all Federation ships (all ships, I think) are controlled by pushing buttons, there's no direct action involved, no steering wheel or flight stick. So for Riker to be able to call one up and use it to fly manually was awesome.

Then a couple people were saying that the Enterprise should have been able to take better care of the Sona ships. First, Picard's crew has always let the enemy fire on them a few times before firing back. They're pushovers, but it's always been that way. Kirk or Sisko, probably even Janeway, commanding the Enterprise that day... the Sona wouldn't have had a chance. Plus, the Sona had a subspace weapon banned by the Kittomer (sp?) Accords, so they did have a heck of an unfair advantage. (Why they had to dump the core, rather than just shutting it down, or taking the antimatter injectors offline, is beyond me.)

The third point I remember was the opera. Picard had a huge list of acts/scenes he could have picked from that play Data was rehearsing; surely he could have chosen a worse one. The lyrics of the song ended up appealing to Worf, and they had some significance to the struggle between Data and Picard/Worf at the time, too... from a certain point of view.

"Insurrection" is by far the funniest of the Trek films. The only one which comes close is "The Voyage Home". TVH was funny in the out-of-place sense, and INS was funny in a broader sense. Comedy fans should have a great time with "Insurrection" - there was plenty of humor in that movie. I don't need to have a good laugh to enjoy a Star Trek film or episode, but it did add something to it.

I'm not of American Indian descent, nor was I ever too interested in their history, but for some reason, I really liked the plot, which mirrored what early Americans did with the Native Americans, moving them from reservation to reservation to suit their needs/desires.

As far as the rest of the plot, Picard and the main Baku woman's scenes were great. This is the kind of woman for Picard, and the development of their relationship worked good for the movie. The admiral was a little boring, possibly could have been done better, but what happened to his character (going from being in control to taking a back seat, not where he ended up) was also pretty good.

The planet was amazing. Have they ever done such a beautiful world, at least in the ten movies? I don't think the Genesis planet was this cool.

Action... who says First Contact is the only TNG movie with any action? Insurrection had action all throughout. The space battle was only rivaled by the one in Nemesis, and the scene with the Enterprise flying alongside the Collector was just wicked.

I do have a couple questions about the movie, though. First, how is it Picard and his crew didn't know what was going on from the beginning? I believe Troi said they got everything they needed about "the duckblind mission". I don't know what "duckblind" means, but I assume since the Holoship was Federation, the Federation knew what was to be done with it. That said, would they approve the mission? I think they would have sided with Picard. I don't mean once the Enterprise reached communications range... I mean they wouldn't have approved the project from the beginning. And why again, could the Enterprise not have shot the Collector? Was it cloaked when the Enterprise was there in the first place? If not the Enterprise, couldn't that shuttle Data stole have done significant enough damage to it? If it came to it, they could have rammed the collector with the Holoship, while the Sona were still on it, THEN self-destructed it. Problem solved.

So it's not perfect, but it's great fun to watch. :(

First off, I really like STVI... but it leaves a couple huge questions wide open.

1. What happened to Kronos? In STVI:TUC they said it would be un-inhabitable in 50 years because of the destruction of Praxis. However it's still the Klingon homeworld in TNG and DS9. Do they ever tell us what the peace treaty brings about that solves this problem?

2. What about that prototype Bird of Prey which could fire when cloaked? Surely they could have made more, but in the TNG and DS9 era, mostly DS9 as that involved fighting Klingons, BoPs had to decloak to fire. You'd think after 100 years they could not only make BoPs which could fire when cloaked, but remain shielded when cloaked as well. And I don't believe the "weakness" Kirk exploited is any weakness at all... surely any ship has a heat signature. For that matter, in the cold vacuum of space, they could merely search for heat signatures to detect cloaked ships. What about that?

Oh, I too fell in love with the -E when I first saw it. I just wish we'd see more, like you've said.

I can't stand the original Enterprise from the series, but then, I'm spoiled on CG and advanced model-building techniques. I didn't really like the A, B, or C, either.

Part of me hopes they don't do another TNG Trek movie... Maybe if they mixed in DS9/Voyager crew, it would freshen things up, but it just seems played out. What I'd like to see Patrick Stewart do, is play a character in the Harry Potter film series. After all, he's English, and the film is limited to English actors per Rowling's request. He SHOULD be in a Potter film. It would instantly be my favorite... Patrick Stewart's such a great actor, but I don't think he can do any more with the Picard character. Just my opinion...

Heh... My favorite of the Kirk films is actually IV. I'm a sucker for the time travel episodes, I admit it. The one TOS episode I really know and like had to do with time travel... "The City on the Edge of Forever". Great episode, my father even had it on VHS.

I just re-read trekz' post about STV...good points, but... I didn't think anything of Sulu getting lost in the woods. Actually I felt that scene was extra. My girlfriend and I both laughed when Scotty hit his head. It wasn't insulting, it was funny. He was distracted... it's a very cliche comedy scene, really. As for Uhura... I was surprised by that scene, so I won't even try to defend it. But I did like the focus on Kirk, Spock, and McCoy - it was their movie.

I do agree that STV is the weakest link, but I enjoyed it enough. I would never say it's a bad movie, at least.

Before every other film was butchered for the theater to get an R or PG-13 rating and released on DVD as an "Uncut" or "Unrated" edition with added footage, you would see movies come out a couple or more years after the movie came out on DVD, or previously, VHS, with additional footage to extend the movie. This was a lot more rare, and only done with really good (or at least popular) films.

The first directors cut I remember hearing about was for Terminator 2: Judgement Day. The directors cut was, for the first year or two, only available on Laserdisc, possibly to help save the dying format. It became available on VHS as well, but by this time, DVD was new, and most fans would rather have the theatrical version on DVD than the director's cut on VHS. The director's cut eventually made it to DVD, only to be owned months later by an "extended edition" with one new scene and a new ending.

Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves is one of my favorite movies of all time, and the directors cut just made it better. All it really adds is more information on the Sherrif, but despite being long overdue, it's worth having.

I didn't like "The Professional" when it came out in 1994. It really seemed to be missing something, and I found out that it was. 24 minutes had been taken out of the middle of the film, as several scenes (which were coincidentally all together) were thought to be offensive to American audiences. A few years back, the full version was released in the US. I saw it, and loved it... it's now a welcome addition to my collection. The elements of a 12-year-old girl having a crush on an older man (and in one scene, trying to seduce him) were a bit disturbing, but it was done tastefully, and it helped to make the film work out better.

The one directors cut I didn't like was for my favorite movie, Donnie Darko. They messed with the soundtrack, added some CG effects, and added a couple scenes that didn't really add anything. I think the director's cut is more approachable, easier to watch than the original, but having seen the original over a dozen times and coming to understand it, I've also come to appreciate it, and I found that the directors cut subtracted from that.

(For all movies, I linked to the latest version of the movie on DVD... except for Donnie Darko where I also linked to the original.)

So, which ones hit and missed with you?

I've always liked the Enterprise-E. Though I grew accustomed to the shape of the Enterprise-D, being a longtime TNG fan, and thought it looked better than the original and the Enterprise-A (skip the court-martial, please), and despite the very real possibility that the Enterprise-E is based more on the -A than the -D, I've always been in awe of the -E.

But on repeat viewings of the TNG-based movies (well, the last three, anyway), I've begun to look at the -E differently. It doesn't seem "real"; it almost seems fake in some way. Like they made the baddest ship they could design for brilliant exterior shots, but all the interior shots are like "visual technobabble" to me. In TNG, with the -D, I got the impression that it was a very real and functional ship, that everything had its place, and that if I were aboard, I'd be able to find my way around, and if not run it, at least know where things are to a certain extent. I do realize both - all, in fact - ships are just a bunch of sets on a stage, but still, the -E doesn't quite feel as real as much as it was designed to look good.

Also, it doesn't seem right that Picard and his crew now run this new Sovereign-class ship. Aside from the issue that Paramount wanted something cooler to awe audiences with, I think realistically they should have been given another Galaxy-class. We saw in DS9 that they had plenty of Galaxy-class ships... maybe there were 3 on the screen at one time, two at least.

I'm really mixed on the Ent-E. It's easily the most pleasing-to-look-at ship in any Star Trek movie or series (in my opinion). The Enterprise NX-01 comes close (why does a ship in Starfleet's past look cooler than most of the modern ones?) but the Ent-E takes it. But there's also something unfamiliar about it. Did TOS fans ever feel this way about the refitted 1701 or the 1701-A?

Thanks for that. :angry:

Someone on Amazon made a good point about Generations: The Enterprise-D just wasn't cut out for the silver screen. I suppose the same is true for the original Enterprise, refitted for the original movie. I did see Generations in the theater (I saw all of them from 'Undiscovered Country' on in theaters - I envy all you who saw II - V in theaters) and loved to see that ship blown up that big on screen, but it's not exactly movie material. So maybe Paramount, if not Starfleet, wanted the NCC-1701-D gone to pave way for a more audience-awing vessel.

Oh, while we're on about ST3:TSFS and the Kirk/Kruge fight, my girlfriend just saw TSFS this last week, and now believes that Saddam Hussein's death in "South Park: Bigger, Longer, and Uncut" is taken from TSFS. She says that when Satan hurls him into the fiery pit, he says the same thing to Saddam that Kirk says to Kruge. I can't remember the exact line, but it's something like "I've had enough of you".

So, some are in fact just special editions?

Are any of the Directors Editions a big deal? Surely it's not as drastic as when Lucas remade the Star Wars movies - once in 1997 and again in 2004 for the DVD release.

I'd love to see most of them extended, but not sure I'd buy them... the originals are great enough as it is. But at the same time, I'd like to watch them and see what I can spot.

OK, it only looks like the first two exist as Directors Editions: ST1:TMP ST2:TWOK.

For reference, the links to the others (all Special Collectors Editions or Special Editions) ST3:TSFS ST4:TVH ST5:TFF ST6:TUC ST7:Gen ST8:FC ST9:Ins ST10:Nem (All Amazon.com links. No, I'm not a member of their affiliate program, they're just a good reference for information and user reviews on movies, music, and books... I have bought from them, but hundreds if not thousands more times I've just browsed the site for the info. :angry: )

I did not read all of them, but I did read that ST6:TUC had two scenes added, though it also said that the VHS version (but not first DVD edition?) was similarily extended, so I'm not sure that "counts".

I'd love to see Singer and Devlin make a Trek film. So many of the others have been done by "Trek people"... It would be interesting to see what a couple "outside people" could do with and for the franchise.

I agree with what you said about Paramount wanting to leave their options open, but I can't help but wonder how stupid they'd look making one TNG movie and then dropping the ball.

They wouldn't have had to build the Enterprise-E *as* the Enterprise-E... for all we know, it was just a Sovereign-class ship that was renamed, like what happened with the Sao Paul/Defiant. Enterprise as a ship family has a lot more honor and tradition than Defiant, so it wouldn't be surprising for them to take a ship and rename it Enterprise, to keep the name alive.

I agree, the ending of IV with Kirk getting the new ship was indeed cool. I didn't realize it was the original theme music, but I knew there was something special about that little jingle versus the other Trek themes they've played which evolved from that. I just think they could have paid tribute to that scene, have Picard and his crew looking upon a new ship in awe.

I wish I had seen ST4 in the theater...

I've just realized, they made a mistake introducing the Enterprise-E in Star Trek 8: First Contact. It should have been at the end of Generations. Here's why:

1. ST1:TMP introduced the refitted original Enterprise (and took its sweet time doing so). When that was destroyed in ST3:TSFS, we see the "next movie's" ship, the Bird of Prey. At the end of ST4:TVH, we see the Enterprise-A, though it doesn't actually get used until ST5:TFF.

2. ST7 is shows the Enterprise-B and the Enterprise-D... the Enterprise-E should have been shown at the end as it's the next generation of Enterprise, especially as the movie's title is "Generations". We saw two generations, why not three, especially when coupled with reason #1.

3. Despite having Kirk, Scotty, and... Was it Chekov? Despite having three members of the original cast, the Enterprise-B, Guinan (Whoopi Goldberg), Malcolm McDowell as a villain, scenes with Kirk and Picard, "Generations" seemed a little weak in comparison with the other movies. Whereas "First Contact" had a lot going for it. Did "First Contact" *need* to debut the Enterprise-E? No, and it really didn't... it was just there.

All those considered, Picard's "there's plenty of letters left in the alphabet" line should have been stricken, Picard should have just winked or something, then a shot of the TNG command crew in a shuttle approaching the Enterprise-E. It would have made for a lot better ending, and made Trek fans anticipate a sequel. As it was, they could have simply stopped after "Generations"; why continue? The Enterprise is destroyed and Picard can only *speculate* about a new Enterprise.

I have all ten Star Trek movies, and I took note when the Directors Edition of the first film came out... Then, with almost no notice (to me anyway), there are special editions or directors editions of all of them.

What's the difference? Do they add anything? I mean, to the movie. New scenes and whatnot. Or do they just have extras (the regular DVDs are very light on extras, if they have any, for DVDs)?

Well.... to be fair, it's better to say I didn't give ENT much of a chance, and I'm starting to see that. I downloaded "Broken Bow" (the first episode) and got bored about halfway through. Though, reading posts on here, I get the impression that the series offers plenty to like, so maybe I should have put myself through the first five episodes, and judged it on that.

But I see your point. I wasn't looking so much for people who generally disliked III and V, I suppose I was looking for a hard argument against them, maybe something I had missed.

As for the crazy Vulcan in V, that doesn't confuse me as much. Vulcans aren't machines, they're humanoids who have learned to control their emotions. Teach them differently, or don't teach them about logic and all to begin with, and they'll be just like any other humanoid, or at least so I'd think.

I've seen Insurrection so many times it's not funny. I worked in a store for a year and a half, and they had a VCR in the break room hooked up to a TV. Insurrection was one movie I watched over and over and over. That and Stargate. And the original Star Wars trilogy. I had all these tapes, just left them at work... but Insurrection was the one I watched the most. I'm not Native American, but the parallel between what was happening in that movie, to what happened to the Native Americans, just really worked out well for me. And I haven't seen the movie in a few years... I just might watch it again. The scene where Riker flies the Ent-E manually was just amazing... not to mention the banter between Riker and Data about Riker's chin and an android's bottom. I loved Data's character enough with TNG, but after he got that emotion chip, he just took on a whole new dimension. After one season and 5 episodes of TNG, my girlfriend already loves Data, and I want to show her the TNG movies, but I'm making her wait till season 7's over.

After I moved across the country, I started seeing the Trill in a new dimension. Quite simply, the basis of Dax in DS9 seems to be this character with all these past lives, who keeps drawing on their experiences as she (its current host) goes on. And I got to thinking, we make radical changes in our day to day living. We go to school, we graduate. We get a job, we change jobs. Some of us join the armed forces (nod to VBG :angry: ) and return to civilian life. So we all have these 'past lives' upon which we can draw experience.

I wonder if they were in fact limited in their use of the Nausicaans. Remember, they were based on the Predator from the 1987 movie of the same name. Predator's a little scarier, and can go invisible (like the Jem'hadar's Shrouding), but the resemblance is uncanny. In fact, first time I saw them, I used profanity and said to myself, "The Predator just made a cameo on Star Trek". In fact, though I haven't seen Predator 2 (heard it was a waste of time), could it not be said that Predator was, in fact, a Nausicaan?

I seem to remember Tuvok once telling someone (Kes? Seven?) that, with time, a non-Vulcan could essentially become a Vulcan, in every sense but biologically. That is, they could suppress their emotions, follow the teachings of logic... I don't know about the telepathy part of it, though.

Tuvok was my favorite character on Voayger, and after watching the "Kirk" movies, I'd have to say Spock is my favorite overall Trek character. Tuvok is cool, but he's no Spock.

As for being Vulcan... Well, I do tend to think logically, most of the time. I am passionate on some things, including with my girlfriend, but in all those things, there's a level of restraint about me that's almost Vulcan. I wouldn't put it past (or blame) my girlfriend if she were to start calling me Mr. Spock.

Thoughts?

Let us not forget that in the DS9 episode Take Me Out to the Holosuite, we meet a whole Vulcan crew on a Starfleet vessel.

Going off on a tangent for a bit, remember how Worf and Nog were treated. They were the first Klingon and Ferengi Starfleet officers. Back to the subject at hand, Spock and Tuvok (not sure about ENT's Vulcans) were never treated this way, so far as I can remember. They were Starfleet officers and always equal with the Humans. The Vulcans are a member of the Federation, and the Klingons have a treaty... I think that's how it goes.

Oh, I try to use my Trek glasses whenever I can. I do plan on getting my future children into Star Trek, but I'd rather get the most use out of my stuff than pass it along... I've got no real love for antiques and collectibles.

Jen says she got the glass for 50¢ at the thrift store, when I told her that they're valuable at the cons. She joked about selling it and turning a heck of a profit, but I told her I wouldn't sell it. It's too cool. I like my Star Trek: The Experience glass, but it's a little too tall, and I worry that the sand-letters might wash off, not to mention the tint. If I'm having a Corona or another "good" beer (which is rare... I don't really drink) I like to have it in that glass. But for juice, for day to day stuff, I just use the Spock glass.

Well, I'm not selling mine! Though not a TOS fan, if I had to pick a favorite overall character, it'd have to be Spock, from the movies alone. Tuvok (on Voyager) is cool, but he's nowhere near Spock. Nice try, though.

Anyone have pictures of the other three glasses? Or at least, can you tell us what the differences are?

I don't have a single topic or post to point to, but I get the overall impression from the fan base that Star Trek III: The Search for Spock and Star Trek V: The Final Frontier are disliked, even hated by some. I'm a fan of what I call the "Star Trek saga" which encompasses II-VI, and I don't find a weakness with either film.

First, Star Trek III, only because it comes first. Yes, Spock is brought back, but it fits. Genesis had to fail, and as a side result, Spock being reborn and his growth accelerated made sense. I don't think it took anything away from Star Trek II; that Kirk watched his friend die isn't changed by his return. After all, he's a Vulcan, and as Vulcans are so fond of pointing out, they're superior to humans in many ways. That they can come back from death is a little extreme, but so are all their mind powers. I don't see holding Spock's ability to return from the dead against him as making any more sense than holding his telepathic abilities against him. (Vulcans aren't telepaths in the sense Betazoids are, so far as I can tell, but it seems they at least have the ability upon contact.) We see Kirk and crew rebel against Starfleet; they steal the Enterprise, disable the Excelsior, break out of a space station... it's great.

Second, Star Trek V, the one people love to hate. Why? OK, the whole premise of a madman searching for God is a bit silly, but aside from that, we've got great interaction between Kirk, Spock, and McCoy, from the rock climbing, the campfire, and various scenes throughout the first two thirds of the movie. The focus shifted from the friendship to the main plot, but it didn't stray far from it.

Like I said, I like II, III, IV, V, and VI. I can't imagine watching any of them but II on their own, and if I'm going to watch II, I'm gonna watch the others in order, after it... maybe not that day or week, but eventually. I especially look forward to II and IV, and IV is easily my favorite, but I think III is at least on par with VI. If I had to pick a least favorite, V would be the weakest link, but I don't dislike it at all. I just like the other four better for reasons that they are, in my opinion, better films.