Emotion Chip?

[Tank 0]

With all of the Data fans on this site I was wondering what everyone thought of Data's Emotion Chip in Star Trek Generations. Is he better with it or with out it? I thought that it was a great way to expand on his character and I'm a bit miffed that the writers haven't given it much thought since Generations. Emotion was the main thing that Data had longed for since the very first episode and once he had it the writers just seemed to have swept it under the rug. In First Contact he was able to switch the chip on and off, in Insurrection he had left it on the Enterprise, and in Nemesis it was never even mentioned. I almost wonder about the end of Nemesis though. Did he not almost seem sad when he said "Goodbye"? Just a thought...

[Takara_Soong 4]

I agree that Data's emotions were not explored much after he had the chip installed.

 

In Generations it was more for comedic effect than character development. The scene in Stellar Cartography being one of the few exceptions of that in the movie.

 

In First Contact the Borg Queen did try to use the chip as a tactical advantage but there still was not really any character development there.

 

Insurrection we don't even know if he re-installed the chip after Geordi says he didn't take it with him when he wen to study the Ba'ku.

 

I haven't read it yet but apparently the novelization of Nemesis makes reference that the chip was "fried" from the Borg Queen's efforts. I agree Data did seem emotional when he said goodbye.

 

I was really undecided as to whether I liked Data more with or without the emotion chip in the movies. I would have preferred it if they had explored his emotional development rather than mostly playing it for laughs.

[Mayday 0]

With all of the Data fans on this site I was wondering what everyone thought of Data's Emotion Chip in Star Trek Generations. Is he better with it or with out it? I thought that it was a great way to expand on his character and I'm a bit miffed that the writers haven't given it much thought since Generations. Emotion was the main thing that Data had longed for since the very first episode and once he had it the writers just seemed to have swept it under the rug. In First Contact he was able to switch the chip on and off, in Insurrection he had left it on the Enterprise, and in Nemesis it was never even mentioned. I almost wonder about the end of Nemesis though. Did he not almost seem sad when he said "Goodbye"? Just a thought...

I think Data realy got some use out of it in the movie "First Contact" and now I think he is getting better at useing it ensted of the other way around

[Lessa_Soong 0]

Yes, the novel does claim that the chip was fried.

From what i read, John Logan had not seen any of the movies and was not aware that Data had emotions now, so they had to ditch the chip somehow.

The thing that gets me is, i cannot believe that once Data was able to "FEEL" that he would have ever really wanted to stop. He only got upset in Stel. Cartog. because he felt he failed Geordi. But by the end of Generations, he seened on cloud nine with his emotions. I also have trouble believing that his neural pathways would not be effected by this new ability. Surely once he had the chip in for a while, the pathways would form outside of the "Chip" area and allow him to be able to fell without it.

 

This part in the novel was the final straw for me about this movie. Now, the novel also does hint that Data was "growing" emotions right at the end, however, he was not really aware of it and it was in those last hours. This just seems cruel to me. "Oh, great! i can feel now!" BOOM!

That's just wrong.

This very subject had been on of my soap boxes for a while. I'll stop now before i gain a warning for bad words beiong used....GRRRRR

[Yillara Skye 1]

I am really not sure which way he was better, with emotions or without. I like Data either way, but there were times that he seemed better off without emotions.

 

I agree with Lessa, on the fact that it seemed cruel for him to finally start feeling emotions without the aid of the chip, and then he's gone. I, too, read the novelization and saw that the chip had been fried....something should have been mentioned in the movie. That way people weren't confused when they go to the movie and go "My, Data seemed rather unemotional in this one, didn't he??" A lot of people were quite confused, even though he DID seem to have emotions in Nemesis.

 

Yillara

[Tank 0]

I haven't read the novel version of Nemesis yet but the chip being fried by the Borg Queen doesn't make much since because in Insurrection after Data's mulfunction Picard asks Geordi if it could be his emotion chip and Geordi says "He didn't take it with him". This implies that Data has been using the chip for the past two years since First Contact. I do agree that it would make since that after having the chip for some time that he would start to gain the ability to feel emotions with out it, which would explain the end of Nemesis.

[dsbs 0]

I haven't read the novel version of Nemesis yet but the chip being fried by the Borg Queen doesn't make much since because in Insurrection after Data's mulfunction Picard asks Geordi if it could be his emotion chip and Geordi says "He didn't take it with him". This implies that Data has been using the chip for the past two years since First Contact. I do agree that it would make since that after having the chip for some time that he would start to gain the ability to feel emotions with out it, which would explain the end of Nemesis.

That's my main point on why it's garbage (not necessarily the movie, just that fact). The other one was at the end of the movie, Data said "I imagine I look worse than I...feel"...key word there being FEEL!!

 

I, for one, believe that he always had emotions to some degree anyway (but that's not what we;re discussing, is it), and I liked him both with or "without" although obviously I'm more used to the latter. I thought Insurrection's "We left it behind" line was garbage too since a) they said htey couldn't remove it in Generations and it seems to me the movie would have been better with it and some more character development for Data. Oh well.

 

As for "Oh, great! i can feel now!" BOOM!" I know it's not funny, but htat cracked me up. I don;t know what the point of Data having no emotions in Nemesis was either, he should have been used to them after, what 6? 8? years, it wouldn't have changed anything THAT much. I thought that maybe they wanted Data to develop emotions on his own (I mean without ANY help)but, like lessa said, that doesn't work too well if you're just going to KILL him two seconds later!

 

The emotion chip made no sense. I'd prefer to pretend that Insurrection and Nemesis didn;t happen (or if they did, it was in another universe) or something...

[Yillara Skye 1]

I though that it made no sense too, but that's how they explained it (Obviously, not a great job of doing that). Yes I do remember that last line from First Contact, and I remember the goofy line from Insurrection (He didn't take it with him). I believe that he always DID have emotions, but they became more "developed" over the years. Even though he would argue the point with people, remember he did that EVERY time someone would claim that he HAD emotions.

 

And even though they apparently DID happen, I sure would like to forget certain events in Nemesis!!!!

[dsbs 0]

I guess if you really respect the show, you can't just beleive in selective episodes (or movies). So fine. But I want my Trek 11 and Data back!

[Yillara Skye 1]

I guess if you really respect the show, you can't just beleive in selective episodes (or movies). So fine. But I want my Trek 11 and Data back!

Well, I want him back too!!!! Right NOW!!!!!!!

 

Hey, wonder if we're permitted to throw temper tantrums on the board??? Guess not, so "Please, I hope to see Data come back unharmed in Trek XI."

[dsbs 0]

lol...I'd like to throw a tantrum, please...but that's the whole problem witht he st.com boards.

[Yillara Skye 1]

That is why we have OUR thread, dsbs.....

[Lessa_Soong 0]

The thing has been thought out Trek history, that if you start something, you have to keep it going in the next show...at least in some way. If warp Ten is as fast as we can go today, it had to be the same tomorrow unless tomorrow we get Transwarp.

If he had the chip in his head and could not get it out or turn it off yesterday, you need to explain how he can today. Simple. easy. one..two ...three.

so, if you can't follow these rules DON"T WRITE SCRIPTS!

 

Ok, i think i'm done now.

Oh, and i love him no matter what, but i would have like to have seen him explore his emotions further. I want to see how close i got... :)

[Yillara Skye 1]

I agree, they DID need to keep the chip...I mean they DID say that it could not be removed. And Data said himself, that they couldn't. And remember the scene in Stellar Cartography? He felt that deactivating him was the only way to solve the situation, until a way could be devised to remove it.

 

And I said before, I love him either way. :)

[dsbs 0]

and in Immortal Coil (sorry lessa...) Picard was telling Data that he couldn't just switch the thing off everytime things got tough - I wish the writers had read that book!

[Yillara Skye 1]

Either read that book(like dsbs-Sorry Lessa), or paid attention to Generations!!

[Tank 0]

Either read that book(like dsbs-Sorry Lessa), or paid attention to Generations!!

Not that I would fault anyone for not paying attention to Generations but your right, they should have kept the chip. If they were going to forget anything from Generations it should be Kirks death scene! At least Data's death served a purpose and it wasn't just because he had become too old and fat to be able to take a fall.

 

If there is another movie(and there better be!) as much as I love Data I don't think it would be fare to bring him back. We've all gone through the truama of loosing him and I think it would be wrong to cheapen his death of bringing him back. I don't object to them doing something with B4 however. Perhaps they can find a way to make him smarter, I would be okay with that. As long as they honer Data's death.

[Lessa_Soong 0]

The thing about keeping Data dead, is that i really feel there is still a great NEED for him. Lore needs fixing. B-4 now needs protecting. Maddox is still there and only Data had the little piece of paper with his rights to wave at them. I am not sure that one could really call B-4 Sentient.

 

As for Kirk's death, he said in one of the past movies that he always knew he would die alone. I wish that they would have found a good and inspiring way to honor that preminition.

[Yillara Skye 1]

The thing about keeping Data dead, is that i really feel there is still a great NEED for him. Lore needs fixing. B-4 now needs protecting. Maddox is still there and only Data had the little piece of paper with his rights to wave at them. I am not sure that one could really call B-4 Sentient.

 

As for Kirk's death, he said in one of the past movies that he always knew he would die alone. I wish that they would have found a good and inspiring way to honor that preminition.

You can definately add my name to the list that would agree that this scenario is true. He has so much he still need to do. Lore could be brought back and B4 is (I agree) not to the state of sentience yet. If we all remember it took several memory transfers for Lal to become sentient, so I am sure that one memory transfer was not enough for B4!

[Takara_Soong 4]

I guess that could be said for most who die before their time - there's still so much to do. I too would like to have Data back but only if it is done right and not a Dallas treatment - Picard wakes up one morning to find Data in his shower!

[Yillara Skye 1]

TAKARA! *bursts into giggles, then stops before falling off my chair*

Data in Picard's shower!?!?!? *giggling again*

 

Actually, I agree that however he is brought back, it should be a respectful to him and the sacrifice he made. And Takara, do you agree with the fact that B4 did not reach the state of sentience? How about everyone else? See you on the new thread I am about to start.....You'll find it on the Movies boards

[Takara_Soong 4]

I agree that he has not yet reached sentience. Hopefully when he has fully assimilated Data's programming and memories he will be. If Maddox or Haftel come within a star system of B4 I will be there with phasers set to maximum!!!

[Lessa_Soong 0]

If Maddox or Haftel come within a star system of B4 I will be there with phasers set to maximum!!!

 

This is my big worry. If they can submit that since B-4 was danger so much so that even Data turned him off, they may have a reason for gettign their hands on him, and that may lead to them gettting Lore too. (Shutters)

Data had to come back to protect his family. and make more

[Data 0]

Data's emotion chip. I wonder if Data should be burdened with emotions. They just get in the way. Then on the other hand, he could get a sense of humor.

[Data 0]

Ignor my last post. I was just being silly.

[Takara_Soong 4]

If Maddox or Haftel come within a star system of B4 I will be there with phasers set to maximum!!!

 

This is my big worry. If they can submit that since B-4 was danger so much so that even Data turned him off, they may have a reason for gettign their hands on him, and that may lead to them gettting Lore too. (Shutters)

Data had to come back to protect his family. and make more

I think the danger that B4 represented is over now that Shinzon is gone. I don't think Picard would have re-activated him if he thought he was still a danger to the ship and crew.

 

And if Maddox or Haftel get within a 1000 km of Lore then I'll have two phasers set on maximum!!!

[Lessa_Soong 0]

i agree that B-4 is no long a threat, but you know how those two are...any excuse...and this is just the one that they may use.

With Data gone, they may have more leverage to get at our two remaining brothers.

 

i think that if they tried to get a LOre, unless the first thing they did was to wipe his memory, he would find a way to Infiltrate their computer system and get away, but B-4 would have no such luck. He would be dead as some as they opened his head.

[Yillara Skye 1]

Hee Hee, evil thought here....Maybe they should try to get Lore, then he can infiltrate their computers and before he gets away...HE uses the phasers set at maximum that are pointed at Maddox and Haftel! Either that or he can beat them half to death! I DID say...evil though here!

 

Now, B4...he is too mentally young to even think of doing something like that. He is essentially a baby still, so he wouldn't know that those two filthy credents are evil as the day is long! He'd probably think they are going to help him!

 

Data needs to come back, help Lore and protect B4. That would be such an interesting move, IMO!

[dsbs 0]

I don't care why he could come back (you all make valid points, but hear me out) i just want him back! I'm desparate here! Everytime I think of Nemesis I get all teary and get that nasty, horrible, hopeless empty feeling inside. I don't care how ridiculous it is!!

[Lessa_Soong 0]

WHY do you think i have just deleted the memory engrams that contained the movie? He cannot die and stay that way...How could he meet Teagan? (tee hee)

 

There is just too much for him to do yet and i cannot LIVE WITHOUT him! AHHHHHH!

Please! i have to have a live subject for my writting! Dead people make very poor lead characters...and they have very little dialog!

 

But seriously....I am beginning to think that we are going to need Devine interverntion, but i think we will have to settle for Q.