Rush Limbaugh blasts McNabb

[subcommanderbeavis 0]

I recently read this article and thought it was kind of funny.The media seems to want to turn this into a racist attack,when all Rush was doing is stating his opinion on the matter.Comments welcomed.Should be interesting.

Limbaugh-McNabb Controversy

Edited October 1, 2003 by subcommanderbeavis

[trekkiebabe 0]

I heard Rush's comments,and don't believe they were innocent or free of prejudice at all.Rush is a bigot.Years ago when many native americans were protesting the Washington Redskins,Rush drew a "mascot" for his tv show to mock the seriousness of the native american's protest.The mascot was an african with terribly enlarged lips,nose,and rear-end,wearing a mix of native american and african dress.He called the mascot "Chief Sambo".He claimed that was all in innocence and fun,too.He makes me sick.

[Theunicornhunter 2]

ESPN

 

As I've stated before I'm no Rush Limbaugh fan...and because I'm not a sports fan I'm a little out of the loop on this but I did read about it.

 

The best I can tell this is the quote that has everybody going.

 

Before McNabb led the Philadelphia Eagles to a 23-13 victory over the Buffalo Bills on Sunday, Limbaugh said during ESPN's pregame show that he didn't think McNabb was as good as perceived from the start.

 

"I think what we've had here is a little social concern in the NFL. The media has been very desirous that a black quarterback do well," Limbaugh said. "There is a little hope invested in McNabb, and he got a lot of credit for the performance of this team that he didn't deserve. The defense carried this team."

 

Seems to me he's saying

1. McNabb was over-rated

2. The media, the NFL and the public want to see a black quarterblack do well and maybe gave McNabb more credit than he deserves because of it.

3. McNabb received credit for wins that really should have been credited as team efforts.

 

I don't follow football so I have no idea if McNabb is good or not. I wasn't aware there was a shortage of black quarterbacks...which I take it is at the heart of the controversy.

 

Was there more said than this article expresses, otherwise based on the written word I am not sure I understand the controversy. He obviously criticized McNabb but isn't that rather common for athletes? I'd like to hear more detail?

 

As for the Mascot that trekkiebabe describes...that does seem offensive.

[mr_tinkles 0]

As far as I know there is no shortage of black quarterbacks in the NFL.I can think of a half-dozen with no problem at all,and McNabb is an excellent QB.If Rush thought McNabb was overrated,he shoud have just said,"Hey,I think the guys overrated."and left it at that.

I remember Chief Sambo.He appeared as a sketch drawing on only a single episode of Limbaugh's show,just long enough for Rush to show his audeince and crack a few very unfunny jokes,and then the drawing was put away and never seen again.I'm not one-hundred percent ready to call Rush a bigot.Maybe just terribly insensative,or my favorite,just plain ignorant.

[Takara_Soong 4]

From my perspective, race does play a part in this as long as someone like Mr. McNabb is referred to as a black quarterback rather than as a quarterback. Has anyone ever heard someone say "Brett Favre, the white quarterback for Green Bay" or refer to someone as the black receiver or the white linebacker - no. The first black starting quarterback was Marlin Briscoe for the Denver Broncos. His rookie season was in 1968. There have been a number of black starting quarterbacks since that time including 10 who will have started a game this season alone. Isn't it time to drop the racial designation and let these gentlemen just be quarterbacks?

[Captain_Smiley 0]

From my perspective, race does play a part in this as long as someone like Mr. McNabb is referred to as a black quarterback rather than as a quarterback.  Has anyone ever heard someone say "Brett Favre, the white quarterback for Green Bay" or refer to someone as the black receiver or the white linebacker - no.  The first black starting quarterback was Marlin Briscoe for the Denver Broncos.  His rookie season was in 1968.  There have been a number of black starting quarterbacks since that time including 10 who will have started a game this season alone.  Isn't it time to drop the racial designation and let these gentlemen just be quarterbacks?

Brilliantly said,Takara.My sentiments exactly.Bravo

[Theunicornhunter 2]

From my perspective, race does play a part in this as long as someone like Mr. McNabb is referred to as a black quarterback rather than as a quarterback.  Has anyone ever heard someone say "Brett Favre, the white quarterback for Green Bay" or refer to someone as the black receiver or the white linebacker - no.  The first black starting quarterback was Marlin Briscoe for the Denver Broncos.  His rookie season was in 1968.  There have been a number of black starting quarterbacks since that time including 10 who will have started a game this season alone.  Isn't it time to drop the racial designation and let these gentlemen just be quarterbacks?

So there hasn't been an issue with black quarterbacks? Like I said I'm not much on sports but I have heard bits and pieces about there not being enough black managers or coaches I thought perhaps this was the same - an active campaign to increase numbers.

 

If there hasn't been an issue then I agree it is not necessary to mention race and his comments would have been out of line.

[Takara_Soong 4]

From my perspective, race does play a part in this as long as someone like Mr. McNabb is referred to as a black quarterback rather than as a quarterback.  Has anyone ever heard someone say "Brett Favre, the white quarterback for Green Bay" or refer to someone as the black receiver or the white linebacker - no.  The first black starting quarterback was Marlin Briscoe for the Denver Broncos.  His rookie season was in 1968.  There have been a number of black starting quarterbacks since that time including 10 who will have started a game this season alone.  Isn't it time to drop the racial designation and let these gentlemen just be quarterbacks?

So there hasn't been an issue with black quarterbacks? Like I said I'm not much on sports but I have heard bits and pieces about there not being enough black managers or coaches I thought perhaps this was the same - an active campaign to increase numbers.

 

If there hasn't been an issue then I agree it is not necessary to mention race and his comments would have been out of line.

The number one goal for any team in any sport is to have the best players they can get on the field/ice/whatever. Coaches don't care whether their quarterback is black, white or purple as long as he gets the job done.

[Theunicornhunter 2]

The number one goal for any team in any sport is to have the best players they can get on the field/ice/whatever.  Coaches don't care whether their quarterback is black, white or purple as long as he gets the job done.

Not in the real world (not in the US) If there is a perception of underrepresentation - then correcting that perception (for fear of lawsuit or bad press) is a serious motivator. And I know the issue of underrepresentation has been raised in other contexts such as team managers....

 

Apparently some people consider it an issue regarding quarterbacks as well...

 

BlackAthlete.com

 

But I don't know if it was still considered an issue and I didn't hear his comments. ..how you say something says more than just what's written on paper.

 

Truth is Limbaugh is probably loving the publicity.

Edited October 2, 2003 by TheUnicornHunter

[VaBeachGuy 12]

As the only Eagles fan here (That I know of) and as a huge McNabb fan let me weigh in.

 

Firstly, McNabb is one of the best QB's in the NFL IMO. He's had a rough start this season but that's normal for any QB at times. Rush is a Steelers fan so there could be a bit of an inter-State rivalry at play when he said that he's overrated, but that's speculation on my part.

 

As for DMac's ability, he is probably upper middle of the pack when it comes to passing but he leads the pack when it comes to running. He has the highest yards per carry of anyone ever in the history of the NFL. (That includes running backs).

 

What Rush said was incorrect when it comes to DMac's ability, but I don't know if it was incorrect from the standpoint of the publicity given to a QB because of his color. It does seem at times that the press will focus in on a black QB more because they are black then because of their ability. Is that wrong of the media? It doesn't bother me, the fact is that until recently there weren't a lot of black starting QBs. The reason for that was a racial issue I believe but now that that "barrier" has been torn down more attention is focused on the men that fill those positions then otherwise might be if he was of another racial background.

 

As a lifelong Eagles fan it is totally normal and natural for me to see a black QB wearing the silver wings on his helmet. Randall Cunningham was one of my all time favorite players and he of course played for the Eagles and was a black QB.

 

I wish Rush hadn't spoken out the way he did, he really should have known better especially after what happened to Jimmy The Greek, but I have been listening to Rush for almost 15 years on the Radio and I know that he isn't a racist. He had Clarence Thomas preside over his wedding after all. The Sketch on his TV show back in the early 90's is, I believe being taken out of context. I remember seeing it and I don't fully remember the situation but I believe he was trying to point out the absurdity of the whole situation.

 

I find it disturbing though that Presidential candidates were demanding he be fired over these remarks, which weren't remarks stating that Race got him his job nor were they remarks stating that his race makes him less of a player or person. Just that the media was giving unwarranted attention and credit to him because of his race. It was an opinion, that's why ESPN hired him. To give his opinions.

 

The question in my mind here is, where is freedom of speech and freedom of the press? Where is tolerance? Where is open debate?

 

I am disappointed in the remarks Rush made. I believe them to be inaccurate. But I am more disappointed that he was forced to resign because he spoke his mind, and you should have no doubts. This whole brewhaha wasn't over his remarks. The remarks weren't that bad, the whole brouhaha is coming from people that oppose him politically. This is a way to silence a political foe. And that's more dangerous then any remarks Rush made.

[subcommanderbeavis 0]

I find it disturbing that Presidential candidates were demanding he be fired over these remarks, which weren't remarks stating that Race got him his job nor were they remarks stating that his race makes him less of a player or person. Just that the media was giving unwarranted attention and credit to him because of his race. It was an opinion, that's why ESPN hired him. To give his opinions.

 

The question in my mind here is, where is freedom of speech and freedom of the press? Where is tolerance? Where is open debate?

Yeah,those are pretty much my feelings on the whole deal.As soon as I heard Rush,images of Jimmy The Greek popped up in my head and I just sort of thought,"Oh,my God,here we go again..."And,it seems I was right in thinking that.Why can we have a film geared toward a black audience called "White men Can't Jump",and that's fine,but a white man can't mildly criticize a black football player.It may seem like these two things aren't in the slightest connected.But to me they are.Truth is,blacks can make desperaging remarks about whites and get away with it,but if a white man says anything negative,then bang he's a "racist".

Edited October 2, 2003 by subcommanderbeavis

[Sirius 0]

I like Rush,and don't believe for a moment that he is in any way,shape,or form a bigot/racists.Rush Limbaugh has an unfortunate habit that many of us conservatives have,and that is speaking his mind and being opinionated.That's no crime.Its a shame that ESPN bowed under pressure and let Rush go.He has a great knowledge of the game of football,and I enjoyed his commentary during the games.In the case of McNabb,I think he was wrong.Donovan is an excellent QB and any NFL franchise would be thrilled silly to have him on their team.But,like I said.He should not have been fired.(or forced to resign)

[captainfreeman 0]

I respectfully disagree.IMO,Rush has always been a bigot and a windbag.His comments were inflammatory and half-witted.Donovan McNabb is a tremendous talent and is not overrated.I,for one,am thrilled that he has been issued his walking papers.There was no political conspiricy to silence Rush.Nobody forced him to make such ridiculous statements on national television.

Edited October 2, 2003 by captainfreeman

[Takara_Soong 4]

The number one goal for any team in any sport is to have the best players they can get on the field/ice/whatever.  Coaches don't care whether their quarterback is black, white or purple as long as he gets the job done.

Not in the real world (not in the US) If there is a perception of underrepresentation - then correcting that perception (for fear of lawsuit or bad press) is a serious motivator. And I know the issue of underrepresentation has been raised in other contexts such as team managers....

 

Apparently some people consider it an issue regarding quarterbacks as well...

 

BlackAthlete.com

 

But I don't know if it was still considered an issue and I didn't hear his comments. ..how you say something says more than just what's written on paper.

 

Truth is Limbaugh is probably loving the publicity.

Professional sports in the US have an exemption from a number of labour laws I believe. Maybe one of our American sports fans can elaborate on that as I'm not really that knowledgable on US law.

[VaBeachGuy 12]

The number one goal for any team in any sport is to have the best players they can get on the field/ice/whatever.  Coaches don't care whether their quarterback is black, white or purple as long as he gets the job done.

Not in the real world (not in the US) If there is a perception of underrepresentation - then correcting that perception (for fear of lawsuit or bad press) is a serious motivator. And I know the issue of underrepresentation has been raised in other contexts such as team managers....

 

Apparently some people consider it an issue regarding quarterbacks as well...

 

BlackAthlete.com

 

But I don't know if it was still considered an issue and I didn't hear his comments. ..how you say something says more than just what's written on paper.

 

Truth is Limbaugh is probably loving the publicity.

Professional sports in the US have an exemption from a number of labour laws I believe. Maybe one of our American sports fans can elaborate on that as I'm not really that knowledgable on US law.

Not to my knowledge they aren't, it's just as illegal for the NFL or any other sports league to discriminate against a race as it is for any other company. Which Labor laws do you believe they are exempt from?

[master_q 0]

I'm not going to go into detail and I made some comments in Risa. If I were him I would not have said it, but he was just stating his view. Race is a factor in the US (like things like affirmative action) - the sad truth.

 

I can think up of examples where the media have been shocked that a white person did well in a predominately black sport. I can think of examples where they have shined up athletes because of this.

 

 

 

I did not see it, but I know Mr. Limbaugh did talk about what TheUnicornHunter said (hiring of African Americans)

 

 

You know the top two people that WORK for Rush Limbaugh on the radio ARE black. I think one of them is Mr. Steardly (the spelling is probably wrong, sorry). Saying that he is a bigot is false.

 

 

. . .

 

 

Master Q

StarTrek_Master_Q@yahoo.com

[trekkiebabe 0]

the top two people that WORK for Rush Limbaugh on the radio ARE black. I think one of them is Mr. Steardly (the spelling is probably wrong, sorry). Saying that he is a bigot is false.

 

 

. . .

 

 

Master Q

StarTrek_Master_Q@yahoo.com

What does that prove?

A lot of bigots employ blacks.I have an great-uncle on my mother's side (he is dead now),who owned an auto-repair business.When I was a little girl I knew he was a racist and hated blacks (and anyone else who wasn't white),yet his business was in a predominately black neighborhood and he did a brisk trade with the residents.When I asked him why,he smiled and said,"I don't have to like them (racial slur) to do business with them.They're money spends as good as any white mans."That disgusted me,and still does.He even employed a black assistant,and enjoyed calling him his own personal (racial slur).So your statement proves nothing.

I agree again,with captainfreeman.Rush is a racist,and a half-wit.

[Sirius 0]

I just read that now Rush is being investigated for the illegal purchase of perscription drugs.Its on the Yahoo! news boards.

When it rains it pours. :P

[Takara_Soong 4]

Not to my knowledge they aren't, it's just as illegal for the NFL or any other sports league to discriminate against a race as it is for any other company. Which Labor laws do you believe they are exempt from?

I thought their exemption from antitrust laws included a number of labour issues. I'm not that familiar with your antitrust laws though.

Edited October 3, 2003 by Takara_Soong

[Captain_Redneck 0]

Rush is the greatest,God bless him!I hope he survives this latest round of attacks by the left,as he has in the past. :P

[therabidirishman 0]

Wow.When did this happen?I recently lost my cable (with school expenses I could not afford it for a while),and haven't watched much tv lately,as I have been busy with work and school,and other things.

I like Rush,and have enjoyed his show for many years.He is an incredibly smart,and witty guy that isn't afraid to tell it like he see's it,making no apologies.I don't believe his comments were racist,at all.Just a bit more direct than most people in our modern,overly-sensitive country feel comfortable with.I agree,in part.McNabb gets a ton of press,but what has he done in Philly?A few playoff apperances?A few great starts to seasons that ultimately ended in .500 records or worse?And for that,he gets heralded as the second-comming?I think his being a black QB has a bit to do with that.

Its too bad Rush is gone from the NFL.The man knew his football.

[master_q 0]

For being a bigot I'm not going to address that because it just shows ignorance. Next I will be called a bigot just because I don't support things like affirmative action.

 

 

Here is an article that was linked from Mr. Limbaugh's site.

 

Rush Limbaugh Was Right

Donovan McNabb isn't a great quarterback, and the media do overrate him because he is black.

By Allen Barra

Posted Thursday, October 2, 2003, at 3:33 PM PT

 

In his notorious ESPN comments last Sunday night, Rush Limbaugh said he never thought the Philadelphia Eagles' Donovan McNabb was "that good of a quarterback."

 

If Limbaugh were a more astute analyst, he would have been even harsher and said, "Donovan McNabb is barely a mediocre quarterback." But other than that, Limbaugh pretty much spoke the truth. Limbaugh lost his job for saying in public what many football fans and analysts have been saying privately for the past couple of seasons.

 

Let's review: McNabb, he said, is "overrated ... what we have here is a little social concern in the NFL. The media has been very desirous that a black quarterback can do well—black coaches and black quarterbacks doing well."

 

"There's a little hope invested in McNabb, and he got a lot of credit for the performance of his team that he didn't deserve. The defense carried this team."

 

Let's take the football stuff first. For the past four seasons, the Philadelphia Eagles have had one of the best defenses in the National Football League and have failed to make it to the Super Bowl primarily because of an ineffective offense—an offense run by Donovan McNabb. McNabb was a great college quarterback, in my estimation one of the best of the '90s while at Syracuse. (For the record, I helped persuade ESPN Magazine, then called ESPN Total Sports, to put him on the cover of the 1998 college-football preview issue.) He is one of the most talented athletes in the NFL, but that talent has not translated into greatness as a pro quarterback.

 

McNabb has started for the Eagles since the 2000 season. In that time, the Eagles offense has never ranked higher than 10th in the league in yards gained. In fact, their 10th-place rank in 2002 was easily their best; in their two previous seasons, they were 17th in a 32-team league. They rank 31st so far in 2003.

 

In contrast, the Eagles defense in those four seasons has never ranked lower than 10th in yards allowed. In 2001, they were seventh; in 2002 they were fourth; this year they're fifth. It shouldn't take a football Einstein to see that the Eagles' strength over the past few seasons has been on defense, and Limbaugh is no football Einstein, which is probably why he spotted it.

 

The news that the Eagles defense has "carried" them over this period should be neither surprising nor controversial to anyone with access to simple NFL statistics—or for that matter, with access to a television. Yet, McNabb has received an overwhelming share of media attention and thus the credit. Now why is this?

 

Let's look at a quarterback with similar numbers who also plays for a team with a great defense. I don't know anyone who would call Brad Johnson one of the best quarterbacks in pro football—which is how McNabb is often referred to. In fact, I don't know anyone who would call Brad Johnson, on the evidence of his 10-year NFL career, much more than mediocre. Yet, Johnson's NFL career passer rating, as of last Sunday, is 7.3 points higher than McNabb's (84.8 to 77.5), he has completed his passes at a higher rate (61.8 percent to 56.4 percent), and has averaged significantly more yards per pass (6.84 to 5.91). McNabb excels in just one area, running, where he has gained 2,040 yards and scored 14 touchdowns to Johnson's 467 and seven. But McNabb has also been sacked more frequently than Johnson—more than once, on average, per game, which negates much of the rushing advantage.

 

In other words, in just about every way, Brad Johnson has been a more effective quarterback than McNabb and over a longer period.

 

And even if you say the stats don't matter and that a quarterback's job is to win games, Johnson comes out ahead. Johnson has something McNabb doesn't, a Super Bowl ring, which he went on to win after his Bucs trounced McNabb's Eagles in last year's NFC championship game by a score of 27-10. The Bucs and Eagles were regarded by everyone as having the two best defenses in the NFL last year. When they played in the championship game, the difference was that the Bucs defense completely bottled up McNabb while the Eagles defense couldn't stop Johnson.

 

In terms of performance, many NFL quarterbacks should be ranked ahead of McNabb. But McNabb has represented something special to all of us since he started his first game in the NFL, and we all know what that is.

 

Limbaugh is being excoriated for making race an issue in the NFL. This is hypocrisy. I don't know of a football writer who didn't regard the dearth of black NFL quarterbacks as one of the most important issues in the late '80s and early '90s. (The topic really caught fire after 1988, when Doug Williams of the Washington Redskins became the first black quarterback to win a Super Bowl.)

 

So far, no black quarterback has been able to dominate a league in which the majority of the players are black. To pretend that many of us didn't want McNabb to be the best quarterback in the NFL because he's black is absurd. To say that we shouldn't root for a quarterback to win because he's black is every bit as nonsensical as to say that we shouldn't have rooted for Jackie Robinson to succeed because he was black. (Please, I don't need to be reminded that McNabb's situation is not so difficult or important as Robinson's—I'm talking about a principle.)

 

Consequently, it is equally absurd to say that the sports media haven't overrated Donovan McNabb because he's black. I'm sorry to have to say it; he is the quarterback for a team I root for. Instead of calling him overrated, I wish I could be admiring his Super Bowl rings. But the truth is that I and a great many other sportswriters have chosen for the past few years to see McNabb as a better player than he has been because we want him to be.

 

Rush Limbaugh didn't say Donovan McNabb was a bad quarterback because he is black. He said that the media have overrated McNabb because he is black, and Limbaugh is right. He didn't say anything that he shouldn't have said, and in fact he said things that other commentators should have been saying for some time now. I should have said them myself. I mean, if they didn't hire Rush Limbaugh to say things like this, what they did they hire him for? To talk about the prevent defense?

http://slate.msn.com/id/2089193/#ContinueArticle

 

 

Master Q

StarTrek_Master_Q@yahoo.com

[edmcgon 0]

NFL Players/Coaches Views on the Limbaugh Comment

 

The above link to an article on some of the NFL players and coaches views shows the people who know the game are against Rush's view.

 

I do not know whether Rush is racist. I do know his knowledge of pro football is lacking.

 

Master Q,

Comparing McNabb to Brad Johnson is a poor comparison. Johnson has been playing football much longer than McNabb. In addition, Barra's comment that Johnson was mediocre was just wrong. Johnson may not be one of the all-time greats, but he is a very good quarterback.

 

To make a true comparison between the two, we need to look at both players' stats at a comparable point in their careers. After 4 seasons in the league (which was as of the end of last season for McNabb), following are the stats for both Johnson and McNabb:

 

QB ATT COMP COMP % YARDS TD INT TD % INT %

McNabb 1639 932 56.9% 9835 71 38 4.3% 2.3%

Johnson 836 517 61.8% 5716 37 24 4.4% 2.9%

 

McNabb played a lot more during his first two seasons, so his numbers are larger for the period overall. While Johnson does have a significantly higher completion percentage, his interception percentage is also higher. Both have very close touchdown percentages.

 

I would also point out that Johnson did NOT win a Super Bowl during his first four years. Neither did Dan Marino, Dan Fouts, Fran Tarkenton, John Elway, Steve Young, or Phil Simms. The year Jeff Hostetler won it he had NEVER been a starter at the beginning of any season prior.