TransporterMalfunction 1 Posted August 29, 2003 (edited) Do you feel that Voyager started stronger or finished on a high? It is generally accepted that TOS was at it's best in the first season, while DS9 got better as it developed further (with Worf!). But how do you feel about Voyager? Edited August 29, 2003 by TransporterMalfunction Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Bolivar 0 Posted August 29, 2003 Because Voyager moved from one area of the delta quad to another over the 7 years, I can't say that it was better at the beggining or the end. It was just different. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TransporterMalfunction 1 Posted August 29, 2003 How about the contrast in the major villians such as the Kazons and the Borg? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ensign_beedrill 0 Posted August 29, 2003 I think that Voyager had a stronger ending. I'll admit, I haven't seen very many of the earlier episodes, but from what I have seen, it seemed... undeveloped. As is bound to happen, the crew grew closer as time went on and their characters became more developed and dynamic. When you first start out with characters you have to try them around, poke them, push them, squeeze them, and try to find out what they're all about. By the end of the series, I think their characters were all explored and it was a crew you felt like you knew. If you were suddenly plopped in the middle of them, you would feel like you were amongst friends. Going back and watching "Caretaker" after seeing most of the later episodes and "Endgame" was very interesting. There was a stark contrast between the characters and the way they were portrayed. In "Caretaker," it almost seemed as though the characters were flat. Even though I knew them, they seemed different to me. Anyway, I just think Voyager had a stronger ending than beginning because of all of the developments they made in the middle. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TransporterMalfunction 1 Posted August 29, 2003 (edited) I was recently looking at Encounter at Farpoint and All Good Things, and I noticed quite a difference that I had not realised when watching originally, it was the same with End Game and Caretaker. It was quite surprising although I still enjoy seeing raw characters as they have so much potential, Tom Paris is one such character that I actually prefered in the earlier seasons. Edited August 29, 2003 by TransporterMalfunction Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fredbroca 0 Posted August 29, 2003 I think that the show developed over the seven years and got better but endgame I was disapointed in I would have prefered it not to be time travel or the borg and I really would like to have seen what happens when they got back to earth and not the future in the other time line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deagletime 1 Posted August 29, 2003 (edited) too be honest..i hated the kazon..they just seemed so filthy...for sure the hunters, species 8472, and the borg were worthy adversaries..but it seemed in the beginning the plots were so lame (giant protoplasm eats ship..swarm of little bee-like ships..etc) it was also nice to see the crew bond together as was most evident in the scene in the briefing room on engame "to the journey!" lastly how can we forget trading in the keebler elf-ette for the beautiful seven of nine...she will get no resistance from me Edited August 29, 2003 by deagletime Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Goose 0 Posted August 29, 2003 Stardate:213658.8 I think it had a stronger ending.I thought the begginning of Voyager wasnt that good Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trekzone 0 Posted August 29, 2003 Endgame by far!!!! it was v.v. good, its given me ideas for my fan fic! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NordicBearskin 0 Posted August 29, 2003 I think it was a lot like DS9, Voyager got better as it grew older. Obviously, we are not going to appreciate the characters ater a couple of shows, after all we hardly know anything about them. As time passed we learned so much about the characters and they really did develop and grow. After all, look at Ensign Kim. What a change from the naive, shy and uncomfortable individual straight out of StarFleet academy to the soaciable, confident, intellgent and enthusiastic senior officer who was a valued member of the crew. The average episode/story arc plots also became better towards the end. However, I think that the same thing could be said for all of the Star Trek's. (with the exception of TOS as I have never seen it) The writers have to establish a solid foundation for the series first, then they can become more creative and imersive; and have more freedom. In conclusion then, Voyager at the end was better then Voyager at the beginning. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gotabite 0 Posted August 29, 2003 I enjoyed "The Caretaker." So I thought Voyager had a very good beginning. I also enjoyed a good bit of the first season. ...getting to know the characters, etc.........Though Seska was an exciting villain, I never could much get into the Kazon.......There was a lull for me with Voyager in the next couple of seasons. There were always a few good episodes here and there. But for me the show plots began to pick up again around the 4th season, and got better and better with each following season. My favorite villains in Voyager will always be the BORG. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Commodore Stone 0 Posted August 30, 2003 It's interesting that this view is about 180 degreess from the consensus on another board that I contribute to, where Voyager is rather mercilessly bashed. I think most any show improves over time, barring massive outside interference (like season three of TOS ) I just saw Caretaker agin, for the first time since it ran in 1995, over the last two nights. I think, as I thought at the time, that it made a strong and promising beginning. Like DS9and TNG both, it took a while to find it's focus. The Kazon turned out to be a bland and unworthy foe. I preferred the Hirogen, Sp. 8472 and (orf course) the Borg as adversaries. I also liked the importation of Seven (though not necessarily the subtraction of Kes), which added a new and really intriguing dynamic to the crew. Whatever the various producer's original motives, the common view that that was simply a ratings grab to attract men seems too crude and reductionist. The character was really compelling. They missed some opportunities that I would have liked to have seen explored, but so did TNG. None of the seasons are as consistent as I'd like to see them, but all had an awful lot of outstanding and interesting TV to see. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mj 7 Posted August 30, 2003 Voyager improved over time, and had an excellent ending. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1 Posted September 6, 2003 I think VOY's pilot was the best of the Trek pilots, but "Endgame" was by far better than "Caretaker". A shame Kes and Neelix were absent. At least Neelix got a cameo with Seven. :lol: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
barry 0 Posted September 6, 2003 I thought Voyager got better as it went along,with better story lines and the meeting of new species etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
APW 0 Posted September 8, 2003 Star Trek:Voyager had a far more promising start than all of the other Trek series,except for TOS's "The Cage". I though,"Great,here is a Starfleet crew stranded in the middle of unexplored space...supposedly Borg space,and they have no one but one another to lean on when trouble calls..."There would be strange new worlds to explore,exotic alien civilizations to encounter,new threats to overcome... but the show never really delivered on those things to any great extent.. and after Seven of Nine showed up,Voyager went Borg crazy,and began to focus 99-percent of the episodes on Janeway,Seven,and The Doctor... I thought the final episode was just so weak...it seemed like a rushed writing job,and so many of the things in that episode (Chakotay and Seven,for instance,made no sense!).... Voyager began with a bang and ended with a whimper...too bad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1 Posted September 8, 2003 I agree, Voyager had an excellent beginning. However, when the show first began, it wasn't "intended" to be near Borg space. Actually, they didn't plan on having the Borg show up on VOY till after they began filming Star Trek: First Contact. Personally, I thought VOY had plenty of strange new words, exotic alien civliazations, and new threats. A few examples would be the Demon planet, the alien race who had never heard of music, and the Kazon threat. As for Seven joining the cast, she was an excellent addition aside from her dumb outfits. The show didn't over use the Borg as they were only featured 12 or so times. I don't consider "Seven" episodes to be Borg episodes any more than TNG/DS9 "Worf" epsodes would be Klingon episodes. As for the big Janeway/Seven/Doctor triad, I think they were trying to re-make the Kirk/Spock/McCoy triad. Anywho, we got plenty of stories on the other characters. The only characters who were underused were Chakotay and Harry Kim in my opinion. As for the finale, I liked it, sure, it felt rushed, but that didn't bother me. My only problem was trying to squish Miral's birth into the finale instead of doing it the episode before. As far as the Chakotay/Seven relationship, they had just started dating, so it wasn't like "wam" and a full blown relationship. Them being a couple was also hinted at in 2 earlier episodes durring Season 7. In my opinion, Voyager began with a bang and went out with a bigger bang. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyalia 0 Posted September 20, 2003 I thought that Voyager finished on a high as well; Endgame is one of my fave eps ever. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Madam Captain 0 Posted September 22, 2003 Hi there B) I haven't seen the entire seven seasons of Voyager yet, although I have seen up to 'Inside Man' in season seven. I think Voyager started off very well, so many things were set up in Caretaker and I liked it right from the start (even though The Thaw was the first Voyager epiosde I ever saw). I haven't seen Endgame yet but I have heard that it went out with a bang. I really like the consistency of Voyager, especially when the characters are discussing certain past situations or away missions. Most of these past events actually occurred in earlier episodes. which makes me want to go back and watch these episodes again. In Macrocosm (one of my favorite episodes) when Janeway was running her tricorder over Neelix, she told him he has fluid on his lungs. Neelix corrects her and says 'lung'. This episode was consistent with the earlier episode (I can't remember the name of it right now) when the Vidians extracted Neelix's lungs. Later, with the help of the Vidians, Kes donated one of her lungs to Neelix. I could write about several more examples but that would take forever. I liked the way the characters developed throughout the seasons, especially the Doctor, Tom and B'leanna. I loved the episodes when the Doctor got into his opera singing, especially Tinker, Tenor, Doctor, Spy. It was interesting that Tom and B'leanna irritated the hell out of each other at first but then they became good friends and this developed even further. As I haven't seen the entire seven seasons yet, I will probably have a different impression when I have seen all the episodes. Linda Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrekkieMage 0 Posted September 22, 2003 I prefered the season's in the middle, the third, fourth and fifth. In Caretaker, the characters were flat and stiff, in Endgame, they seemed...I can't think of the right word. But you knew them so well that you felt everything had been done. They seemed worn, almost as if the last seven years were taking their toll on them. But in the middle, they were fresh. You knew enough about them to know what their reactions to things were like, you understood them. But you didn't know everything about them, there was still more to learn, more to explore. But that's just my opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Angela 1 Posted February 12, 2004 Voyager had a slow start, but that may have been due to the problems that production in the beginning often brings. The ending was much stronger as a cohesive unit. People knew each other and production was a lot tighter. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WEAREBORG4102 0 Posted February 20, 2004 It was more cohesive at the end of the series Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Klingonmike 0 Posted February 20, 2004 I thought Voyager started off well with "Caretaker" and ended strong with "Endgame" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
v_seven 0 Posted February 20, 2004 Wow...Great question.....I loved VOY a lot and there are great episodes in every year, but I'd have to say the ending was better because of the family feeling they all had. I was disappointed in the final episode only because their was no closure,...I would have liked to see even 10 minutes of their arrival at home with family members. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Turak 0 Posted February 22, 2004 I think it's a little better that way, to not see what happens next. Made me want to read the "Homecoming" books when they came out, written by Christie Golden. Those books explained the next few months perfectly. Pick them up if you want a bit of closure...you won't be disappointed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ensign_ro 0 Posted February 22, 2004 i think voy had a good ending.. the begining of the series was ok, but the end i like especialy the last ep end game that was a pretty good end compared to others form other seiries.. like ds9 part 2 of the final ep urg that wasnt to good. but the first season of voy was ok but it got better as it aged in my opinion Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thestupidvulcan 0 Posted February 22, 2004 well as wierd as this may sound... but the first Ep i ever saw of Voyager was Endgame... how sad is that... and it took me the whole epiode to relise that Admiral Janeway And Captain Janeway were the same person.. so yeh... but i still watch the reruns.. i basically watched to whole series backwords... so from my perspective..as the series dragged on... the episodes got better and beter... but thats just me.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BorgAssimilator 0 Posted February 25, 2004 Well we all know Voyager ended with their best episode. I also did like how seven came on the ship during the last (or last few?) seasons. I thought that the episodes did progressivly get better. It might have also been that as the actors acted the parts more, they got more used to them, and able to better portray them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1 Posted February 25, 2004 I also did like how seven came on the ship during the last (or last few?) seasons. Seven of Nine was introduced in "Scorpion, Part II", the season four premiere. She was on the show for all of seasons 4-7. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KayTroi 0 Posted February 26, 2004 I preferred the last few seasons with 7 of 9. To me the show didn't get better til Jeri Ryan appeared as 7 of 9. Star Trek Voyager did have a slow start but there are two from season one that I really liked. They are Caretaker and Faces. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites