Lock Stock And Two Smokin' Phase-Cannon!

[ConnorExum 0]

It seems to me that Enterprise is really lacking in realism. Every new production information about the new season seems to confirm my worst fears about the show's new direction. Those being that the new direction is more of a gimmick to get more action sequences per episode while neglecting character development and realism in the process. This of course is all done in the name of "drama".

 

Let's explore a few of the key areas I find fault with maybe some of you agree with them.

 

1) The Xindi Attack: The lynch pin of the entire new direction is flawed. From a military planner's point of view it's a pointless waste of resources that' potentially could lead the enemy coming to knock on the Xindi's front door.

A) You don't test your weapon on the enemy target unless completely neccessary. The weapon should be first tested completely. Some where safe from view of the enemy. Also considering the enemy, Earth that is, doesn't attack for another 400 years there's no pressure to be hasty about it's development process.

:( Targets, the target should be something of importance. A first strike should attempt to leave the enemy defenseless against the next attack which is the knockout blow which should follow very soon on the heels of the first attack.

C) considering those two facts then why did Berman and Braga go with the implausible attack of a manned probe with a super high energy weapon that attacks then self destructs? It goes against those two basic ideas of a mainting surprise and being striking at vital assets of the enemy's warmachine capablities. I can't tell you that for sure.

 

2) Daniels' Database: It would seem that Archer would want to confirm some of the details of Shadow Man's claims with an independant source. Considering how Archer and him have been at odds since day one. Plus the advantage that it would give Archer would be imeasurable. Being able to know the exact location of the Xindi home world would negate the quest aspect. Also it would allow Archer to plan a flight path that would avoid certain areas. Also knowlegde about the Xindi's ships and command structure would give him excellent ideas on where to start looking for the most vital information and what sort of opposition to expect. Finally it would even the playing the field giving Archer the need intel on the enemy to upgrade his ship and train his crew to the conditions that would be encountered in the unexplored space of the Expanse. As of yet no such mention is made. It's logically something you do before you enter the expanse. Also it would help to define a clear objective for the Enterprise's mission in the Expanse. Something that was left up in the air for the most part at the end. It wasn't clear if they were on a true military combat mission or just more of the same hype with no action.

 

3) Technology: Archer has the very advanced Suliban Cell ship at his disposal to examine and retro fit or reverse engineer many useful componets from to the NX-01. Mainly the cloaking device , shields , and weapons would be of primary concern. However the sensor systems and other advanced system shouldn't be over looked either. The writers seemed to have over looked the realistic nature of military thinkers. That is when they find something very advanced like this usually take it apart and see what advantage it can give their ships. But no such thing happened in the season finale episode. It's very curious when one considers the magnitude of the mission's importance. Failure means Earth's destruction that sort of stake usually makes people bend rules...

 

 

4) Weapons On Enterprise: Archer is taking a ship into the expanse against an unknown enemy of unknown strength with just a modest up grade to the ships weapons systems? Doesn't make much sense does it. Right now Enterprise is barely a self sufficent ship when it comes to offensive and deffsenive capablities. Yet the writers first want us the viewers to believe that A) Archer and Forrest aren't going to consult an intel source with potentially volumes of useful data on tactics , ship design , defenses and other information on the Xindi; the :) Archer isn't going to demand a ship with such a heavy arament that it could take on 5 to 10 ships of greater size with no problem? That's just not realistic. The fate of the planet rests in Archer's hands and he just wants to get the modesty torpedo up grade. No way in reality it would be extra external phase cannon packs on the saucer; mulitple photonic torpedo tubes; retro fitted spacial torpedoe tubes that can fire spacial torpedos and lay a mine field and extra armor protection with possible shields as well. That's what a military commander would demand on this mission and he would need it too.

 

 

5) Continuity and Realsim: Basically most of my completes of this new direction are about realism and continuity. How each one effects the show's feel and turns a decent idea into a bubble gum action adventure with no real depth. First off they just ignore useful items Archer has sitting in his ship no less that could make the mission more believable to what build contrived dramatic senairos about a lone ship out gunned? Two by doing thisi the writers/producers reduced the realism factor which in turn tends to lead to flat action orientated shows... The Expanse is a clear example of this. Sure they had lots of action with the Xindi attack the Klingon attack but in the end the realism was lost because the crew lack realistic reactions to the events and the omission laying of a the mission's foundation left the show feeling hasty and implausable.

A big reason was the lack of continuity between the Expanse and the rest fo the season. Vital resources were neglected and not mentioned that would seem to be real military intel assest for some high speed rush to get into only more action.

 

 

6) Tactics: Archer and his crew need training. Starfleet has been repesented all season as a peaceful organization that only uses force in the direst of need. Howeer this is a military combat senairo no way Archer's crew would combat ready. Training from some friendly race would be required to get the crew ready for the pressures of war. Something that I think that could have really been an interesting aspect to show in the season finale. Not present I guess it's too boring or not dramatic enough for Berman and Braga to show such developments in the crew.

 

7) Mission Objective: Clearly the mission's objectives should be one of destroying the enemy's ablity to attack Earth with the Doomsday Weapon. However the means by which to achieve this objective has never been stated. I think that's a big mistake. Archer should have been given direct orders to take the enemy's weapon , scientists , R&D center and all data concerning the weapon out permently. As well as the factation that has been giving the Xindi information about the future. That factation is a direct threat to Earth and needs to be eliminated. All this must be done with extreme force. Yet never stated in season finale so again it let the viewer wondering exactly how Archer is going to save the day. Well for realisms sake let's just cut to the chase and say violence will occur. Drama can be developed in the changes of the characters and so on.

 

So those are my complaints with the new direction feel free to disagree.. :)

[fredbroca 0]

Wow that gave me a lot to think about and what you say does make sence I mean they really don't have to go rushing in and I really thought that the last show was more about the klingons then anything else.

[ConnorExum 0]

Fred,

 

Isn't the trend to gimmicky storyline devices that seem to over look already stated information in the series getting a little annoying to you too? I mean if they don't build on the elements already present in the series then what are they going to do start over after each season? Or is this just when they need more drama? Well the writers/producers can save that drama for their mamas because it's crap! Drama is developed by characters acting and reacting to events in a realistic manner. Not just running around blasting things like some Vin Diesel movie.

[trekzone 0]

It seems to me that Enterprise is really lacking in realism. Every new production information about the new season seems to confirm my worst fears about the show's new direction.  Those being that the new direction is more of a gimmick to get more action sequences per episode while neglecting character development and realism in the process. This of course is all done in the name of "drama". 

 

Let's explore a few of the key areas I find fault with maybe some of you agree with them.

 

1) The Xindi Attack: The lynch pin of the entire new direction is flawed. From a military planner's point of view it's a pointless waste of resources that' potentially could lead the enemy  coming to knock on the Xindi's front door.

  A) You don't test your weapon on the enemy target unless completely neccessary. The weapon should be first tested completely. Some where safe from view of the enemy. Also considering the enemy, Earth that is, doesn't attack for another 400 years there's no pressure to be hasty about it's development process.

:( Targets, the target should be something of importance. A first strike should attempt to leave the enemy defenseless against the next attack which is the knockout blow which should follow very soon on the heels of the first attack.

C) considering those two facts then why did Berman and Braga go with the implausible attack of a manned probe with a super high energy weapon that attacks then self destructs? It goes against those two basic ideas of a mainting surprise and being striking at vital assets of the enemy's warmachine capablities. I can't tell you that for sure.

 

2)  Daniels' Database:  It would seem that Archer would want to confirm some of the details of Shadow Man's claims with an independant source. Considering how Archer and him have been at odds since day one.  Plus the advantage that it would give Archer would be imeasurable.  Being able to know the exact location of the Xindi home world would negate the quest aspect. Also it would allow Archer to plan a flight path that would avoid certain areas. Also knowlegde about the Xindi's ships and command structure would give him excellent ideas on where to start looking for the most vital information and what sort of opposition to expect.  Finally it would even the playing the field giving Archer the need intel on the enemy to upgrade his ship and train his crew to the conditions that would be encountered in the unexplored space of the Expanse. As of yet no such mention is made. It's logically something you do before you enter the expanse. Also it would help to define a clear objective for the Enterprise's mission in the Expanse. Something that was left up in the air for the most part at the end. It wasn't clear if they were on a true military combat mission or just more of the same hype with no action.

 

3) Technology: Archer has the very advanced Suliban Cell ship at his disposal to examine and retro fit or reverse engineer many useful componets from to the NX-01.  Mainly the cloaking device , shields , and weapons would be of primary concern.  However the sensor systems and other advanced system shouldn't be over looked either. The writers seemed to have  over looked the realistic nature of military thinkers. That is when they find something very advanced like this usually take it apart and see what advantage it can give their ships. But no such thing happened in the season finale episode. It's very curious when one considers the magnitude of the mission's importance. Failure means Earth's destruction that sort of stake usually makes people bend rules...

 

 

4) Weapons On Enterprise:  Archer is taking a ship into the expanse against an unknown enemy of unknown strength with just a modest up grade to the ships weapons systems? Doesn't make much sense does it.  Right now Enterprise is barely a self sufficent ship when it comes to offensive and deffsenive capablities. Yet  the writers first want us the viewers to believe that A) Archer and Forrest aren't going to consult an intel source with potentially volumes of useful data on tactics , ship design , defenses and other information on the Xindi;  the :( Archer isn't going to demand a ship with such a heavy arament that it could take on 5 to 10 ships of greater size with no problem?  That's just not realistic. The fate of the planet rests in Archer's hands and he just wants to get the modesty torpedo up grade.  No way  in reality it would be extra external phase cannon packs on the saucer; mulitple photonic torpedo tubes; retro fitted spacial torpedoe tubes that can fire spacial torpedos and lay a mine field and extra armor protection with possible shields as well.  That's what a military commander would demand on this mission and he would need it too.

 

 

5) Continuity and Realsim: Basically most of my completes of this new direction are about realism and  continuity. How each one effects the show's feel and turns a decent idea into a bubble gum action adventure with no real depth. First off they just ignore useful items Archer has sitting in his ship no less that could make the mission more believable to what build contrived dramatic senairos about a lone ship out gunned?  Two by doing thisi the writers/producers reduced the realism factor which in turn tends to lead to flat action orientated shows... The Expanse is a clear example of this. Sure they had lots of action with the Xindi attack the Klingon attack but in the end the realism was lost because the crew lack realistic reactions to the events and the omission  laying of a the mission's foundation left the show feeling hasty and implausable.

A big reason was the lack of continuity between the Expanse and the rest fo the season.  Vital resources were neglected and not mentioned that would seem to be real military intel assest for some high speed rush to get into only more action.

 

 

6) Tactics: Archer and his crew need training.  Starfleet has been repesented all season as a peaceful organization that only uses force in the direst of need. Howeer this is a military combat senairo no way Archer's crew would combat ready. Training from some friendly race would be required to get the crew ready for the pressures of war.  Something that I think that could have really been an interesting aspect to show in the season finale. Not present I guess it's too boring or not dramatic enough for Berman and Braga to show such developments in the crew.

 

7) Mission Objective:  Clearly the mission's objectives should be one of destroying the enemy's ablity to attack Earth with the Doomsday Weapon. However the means by which to achieve this objective has never been stated.  I think that's a big mistake. Archer should have been given direct orders to take the enemy's weapon , scientists , R&D center and all data concerning the weapon out permently. As well as the factation that has been giving the Xindi  information about  the future. That factation is a direct threat to Earth and needs to be eliminated. All this must be done with extreme force.  Yet never stated in season finale so again it let the viewer wondering exactly how Archer is going to save the day. Well for realisms sake let's just cut to the chase and say violence will occur. Drama can be developed in the changes of the characters and so on.

 

So those are my complaints with the new direction feel free to disagree..  :)

This post involves unmarked quotes from our good friend (sourced above):

Im going to try and rebutt the arguments made:

 

The Xindi Attack: First of all, Humans have been out in deep space for only 2or3 years, naturaly, they would feel jumpy and the need to retaliate, for public outcry. With this in mind you could almost arguee that the targets were selected at random, as they go along.

 

Daniels' Database: "The Temporal Prime Directive". Even tho it doesnt exist, Archer himself said in "Dear Doctor (S1)" "Until someone tells me what i can and cant do out here, im going to have to make my own decisions". With this is mind, he must have thought that using the database might stuff up the TCW....

 

Following the last two points :the technology (to quote 7of9) would be "irrelivent"...they hurt us, and now were gonna hurt them...

 

Continuity & Realism......it wasn't ever going to be a peachy playground for the humans, against almost all of the alien races they are outgunned (Silent Enemy) outengined (Fallen Hero) or outmanned (cant think of one :) )....its actually quite realistic, would you expect everyone to say "Hi, how you going" if you went to an unknown country....your a tresspasser to their decades old space, as far as their concerned "They knew"

 

Tactics: How can Archer and the NX-01 crew be trained beyond "hypothetical" situations??????

 

Mission Objective: Have you ever heard of "To Be Continued...."?

[ConnorExum 0]

To Trekzone...

 

 

Okay obviously you have no understanding of military thinking. Because everything you said is wrong. Military planners always look for advantages. They just don't throw away resources. And the element of surprise is critcal to any first strike. The idea behind the first strike is always to destroy the enemy's ablity to mount a counter attack and also to send the enemy into choas. Not hand over information about your technology for the enemy to examine. Nor is it to just randomly strike at pointless targets of no military value. That's a waste of time and resources.

 

Technology and Tactics... Isn't irrevelant unless you're a moron you damn well know that both are vital to success. Technology is the key factor to success. Technology is what drives the modern battle and the tactics which are employed because of advances. So to say that Archer couldn't use substianial up grades is short sided on your part. Also to think that other friendly races like the Denoblians for example who have obviously been in space for far longer couldn't give Archer and crew some pointers in tactics is absurd. Of course they could.

 

 

To be continued is a joke right you're not that mundane are you? :)

[A l t e r E g o 9]

:( I'm shocked!

 

I'm shocked to see the front against ENT has moved beyond the simple complaint of ENT not conveying the sense of "World Utopia" suggested by TOS, frankly I thought the bashers had a better argument there.

 

[RANT]This has become a case of nit-picking the negative to the nth degree. Your augments sounds EXCATLY like the same type of anti-Trek propaganda I have been hearing from non-fans for 35 years, how does it feel to know you have associated yourself with (and become part of) the enemy? You slam and bash ENT for the good of Trek? Hogwash, you have all gone off on a personal power trip. :( [/RANT]

 

Im going to try and rebutt the arguments made:

 

The Xindi Attack: First of all, Humans have been out in deep space for only 2or3 years, naturaly, they would feel jumpy and the need to retaliate, for public outcry. With this in mind you could almost arguee that the targets were selected at random, as they go along.

 

Daniels' Database: "The Temporal Prime Directive". Even tho it doesnt exist, Archer himself said in "Dear Doctor (S1)" "Until someone tells me what i can and cant do out here, im going to have to make my own decisions". With this is mind, he must have thought that using the database might stuff up the TCW....

 

Following the last two points :the technology (to quote 7of9) would be "irrelivent"...they hurt us, and now were gonna hurt them...

 

Continuity & Realism......it wasn't ever going to be a peachy playground for the humans, against almost all of the alien races they are outgunned (Silent Enemy) outengined (Fallen Hero) or outmanned (cant think of one  )....its actually quite realistic, would you expect everyone to say "Hi, how you going" if you went to an unknown country....your a tresspasser to their decades old space, as far as their concerned "They knew"

 

Tactics: How can Archer and the NX-01 crew be trained beyond "hypothetical" situations??????

 

Mission Objective: Have you ever heard of "To Be Continued...."?

 

Well said fellow Trekker! :( :( :( :) :) :) :(

[Syperphobia 0]

ENT is lacking realism and adding more drama than character development... They are getting too many flaws and inacurate explinations to make this show a great hit. One thing with 'The Crossing' the aliens have this big ship, yet can survive out of space... who operates the ship, in order to actually trap ENT inside?!?! They didn't even consider adding in an alien pilot, or someone involved with these creatures.... (onto the main posting).... The TCW plot, is interesting and adds a new element to the Star Trek SAGA, it good, but can get better. With the series fanile it seems as though, the mysterious man wants to be as a foggy-trustworthy enemy. Although he lauches attacks against the enterprise, somehow he must need something from the Xindi in order for Archer to go into the Expanse (anyway that is my interpertation). The Xindi are cool aliens, but they are created for drama, the ratings are down and they want to take an interesting sci-fi spin, instead of an emotional replay on how they do with all of the rest of the series (but I believe that it is the emotional role-play that makes Star Trek a smashing SAGA).

The technology that ENT has is low key, but if Archer is suppose to be this captain with 'no rules, no prime directive', why not take a peek? If he does he will be the ultimate captain to break all the laws of the Tempral Directive... (a classic Star Trek theme).

 

Here are some pointers that we need to look for when watching the ENT go into the Expanse.....

1) Remeber that everything will not follow the laws of physics, therefore adding excitment and a sense of shock and awe, do not be afraid of this new development for I think it will just be for season three

2) Charater Development vs. Military - With the Military on board the ENT, do not expect to see much Character Development, but watch out for more disciplinary actions and them getting more in the way of personal relationships.

3) Firepower and Battles - Yes, the glory of any good sci-fi series, the heartrenching battles between strong aliens.... Remeber the Klingon know about the expanse as well, and probably will reconfigure their ships in order to hunt down ENT; do not be scared if we do not see though too many Klingons, Andorians, for I am sure they will have an abudnant use of them in Season Four

4) Starfleet - Back on Earth, we might see some pressure as the only real line of defense is gone, creation of a stronger starfleet might take into play.

[ConnorExum 0]

Altergo,

 

You must be some one that thinks if you see any problem at all with Star Trek and point it you're being a basher. I'm not bashing Star Trek in general. I'm bashing Berman and Braga's susposedly bold new direction for Enterprise. Because it's neither bold nor is new and groundbreaking in the Star Trek Saga. It contains elements of both Star Trek IV and Star Trek VIII mish-moshed together with some very poorly constructed revenge theme. From a critcal anaylsis standpoint the new direction lacks any really good possiblities of development in character or storyline if it continues in the manner that the preproduction reports suggest. It's just a simple way to put the crew into more action driven storylines that have gimmicky plot devices...

 

If some new bold direction was the goal of the writers and producers then shouldn't they be exploring areas in realism and character development. You just can't throw the Enterprise's crew into combat and expect an auidence to find it believable after awhile if the storyline is always the same one ship: out gunned and out numered; fighting the incredible odds to save Earth. It's been done a hundred times(not an exact figure) before in Star Trek and now it's getting old.

 

The writers and producers should have attempted to make the story connect a little better to the previous events in the series so far too. I'm supposed to believe that Adm. Forrester wouldn't demand all information on the Xindi from crewman Daniel's Database? That's just stupid. If Archer were real and had any intel on them he would be giving into to boys in Star Fleet intelligence to examine. This then would be used to form a coherent battle plan for Enterprise's mission in the Expanse. Unlike what we see presently which is just a romp in the hostile space with no clue as to who the enemy really is or where they may be. Sort of stupid when you consider they have a database full of information up to the 31st century... Not using there heads from a realistic standpoint nor is it something that fits the continuity of the show. Considering Archer knows of it's existance and has used it before to identify a ship from the future. I think this mission saving Earth qualfies as a good reason to look again. Don't you people?

 

Also Archer has a suliban cell ship in his cargo bay... You're telling me that in the 22nd century Starfleet can't see the advantages of examine an alien ship with greater technological assets? That's another absurd and totally unrealistic aspect of the new direction. Something they did in the haste to get back into the action of the season finale. Realistically the R&D boys back in Starfleet HQ would have that Suliban Cell ship in pieces and would be retorfitting or revese engineering any useful aspect of the ship to fit the Enterprise NX-01... Remember the NX-01 is the only hope for the safety of Earth. So you just don't do a half-assed job on it's upgrades and send it out.

 

As for extra training that would be required too. The crew would be drilled on new tactics in space combat... How to use the new weapon systems most effectively and if they were to be truely realistic they would use Daniel's database to get the specs and so on of the Xindi ships of this time period. That way they could simulate combat in sims for the crew to hone their new skills.

 

Oh wait that's just being nit picky it's so much more dramatic to watch them do loops and shoot them in the back... Right? I mean that's called good story telling. Why would we want to see the crew turn into a fighting force? Nor would it be exciting to see them use some common sense. I guess the average fan is just too dull to see that if Archer were to go shooting it up every where he goes he wouldn't be living very long. He would be hunted down and destroyed. That's why this mission requires a covert sense to it. One that can't be maintained if the writers/producers find it necessary to have Archer blow up everything every where he goes. That isn't drama that's action for action's sake. Drama is created by the stress of the events like in Das Boot. Where the crew is always understress of attack but always trys to avoid any senairo that would give away their pressence before they have too... There's plenty of drama to be created in Enterprise that doesn't require them to shoot it out all the time.

 

Then again I might just be the enemy who's attacking something I don't understand right? Well I understand I poorly constructed idea when I see one that relies on action to fill in the gappin' areas of storyline where there's nothing else... Sad too because ST:TNG was really a good show now Enterprise is killing the franchise. But then again maybe it's time to be put to bed?

[Klingonmike 0]

Enterprise is just as good as any other Star Trek show.The timelines and continuity remain intact with the rest of the Trek universe, they have done an excellent job with that.. I read a mention of military planners,well Enterprise is not a military vessel so that argument is moot.

I'm looking forward to the next 5 seasons of Enterprise and to those who don't like it then don't watch it,its a very simple concept.

[ConnorExum 0]

Klingonmike,

 

I said the writers neglected certain things that concern continuity within Enterprise the series itself not when compared to other series in the Star Trek franchise. In other words they've glossed over already stated facts or seemingly forgot all about certain assets already onboard the Enterprise that could greatly help the mission. These omissions make it hard to swallow certain ideas presented in the finale episode when one expects realistic actions from the crew and commanders in Starfleet.

 

Such as these...

 

1) No intel on Xindi: Well Archer does have a database from the 31st century. So there must be some data on the Xindi probably covering all aspects. Hell with time travel the database could have a complete record of the Xindi development up to their destruction in the 26th century. So it's not like Archer has to go into the expanse with no idea of his enemy. Basically he could use the database to guide him directly to their homeworld then work from there.

 

2) The Cell Ship: The Cell Ship contains a cloaking device and shields... You're telling me that Archer has some how let it slip his mind about these assets wasting away in his shuttle bay... That's not realistic to think Archer is going on a suicide mission and he forgets to tell Adm. Forrester "hey I've got some goddies in the shuttle bay we should try to retro fit to the NX-01 while we upgrade the weapons! " That's just not even using their brains. Of course any reasonable commander in the real world would try to use such assets to give him an edge in combat. Remember for the Enterprise to achieve it's goals it needs to be stealthy... What better way then to sneak up on your enemies using a stolen cloaking device?

 

3) Military Planners: Well military planners might not have been considered viable in the original direction but when one changes gears and switches to this quasi-military operation one must follow it through. Or be faced with a clumsy half assed series that never actually gets to the point. Either make it realistic or just don't do it is what I think. Gimmicky half achieved episodes that lack realism or anything that would seem to be dramatic other then bigger explosions to me isn't the way to go.

Military Planners would be a neccessary part of this new mission for Enterprise. Mainly because once Enterprise destroy's the enemy's doomsday weapon what's to stop the Xindi from attempting an all out conventional assault on Earth? Nothing. Infact it's rather reasonable to assume that Xindi would do it only because they've opened the door to that possiblity with their first strike. Howeve that's only if Berman and Bragga intend to have any realistic actions attributed to the Enterprise's crew, Starfleet Command , The Earth Goverment and The Xindi Governemt. I doubt that will happen.

[fredbroca 0]

Wow this has become one heated argument since I posted yesterday I do have to say everybody is entitled to his or her own opion so far I like enterprise but I have no clue how people can say they have followed the time line but again thats my opion and I can also see the points being made and it really looks like they are tring to put more action in the show so people will watch and I have always thought thats what they tried with voyager and I don't think it worked their so lets hope for character development and a plot in the next season

[ConnorExum 0]

Fedboca,

 

I think this turned into a heated issued when I recieved so many absurd replies to my posting. Sure I might want excessive realism but we all must agree that the peaceful exploration storyline is out for now. Replaced by one of conflict. A conflict storyline demands a certain about of realism and realistic actions to be taken by the characters for it to really be believe for the auidence. And the get postings in response that say I'm bashing it because it's clearly a flawed storyline at present and I've just pointed such huge flaws in realism and plausiblity. What can I say...

 

The writers and producers want the auidence to be engaged bythe storyline yet they refuse to add on once of realistic action by the commanders of Starfleet, Earth's government ,and the crew of Enterprise. They gloss over building block conepts that would make this direction seem realistic just to get to hasty action sequences with gimmicky things like Loops and crap. Nothing is developed nor are they trying to develop this storyline in a manner that would be realistic from a military point of view. How can an auidence really be engaged by a storyline that's so weak it has only action basically in it? Not even plausible action for the senairo they've written. Just pointless action is there only for action's sake. In some attempt to recapture ratings. Even the original had enough sense not use action as a primiary plot device in most of it's scripts.

 

At present I've read three production reports... All them have either Archer shooting it out or being discovered by Alien races. If you're the only ship that stands between destruction of Earth and it's safety in hostile space. You don't go around drawing attention to yourself so the enemy knows you're coming. It sort of defeats your mission before it starts. Yet, that's exactly what the writers and producers are throwing at us. One episode after another of Archer shooting it out. Doesn't anyone get the point that from a realistic standpoint Archer would be vaporized by a Xindi patrol after attacking the Xindi at ever corner. Not to mention if the Xindi know you're coming after them it's a good bet they will tighten up thier defenses making it impossible to destroy the weapon and save Earth.

 

This mission in reality required Archer to be unseen unknown and to take the enemy R&D complex completely by surprise. That's what would happen in reality. However Berman and Braga think that Archer playing cowboy is a better drama. Well we all know that he can't die nor can he fail so where's the drama there? It's just more of the same pseduodrama based on actions that can't happen. One Archer can't be capatured and executed; nor can any of the other members of the cast that are key players. So that sort of detracts from the possible drama. Second, Enterprise can't fail so no matter what Enterprise will win in the end. Three, the events must all some how disappear. So given those fact how much drama can be produced from this storyline? Not awhole hell of alot really if you think about it . It's just not capable of being a dramatic show from that prespective. It can however be dramatic is they let the characters grow and become darker because of this new storyline.

 

Those are just my thoughts. :lol:

[Klingonmike 0]

You talk of realism, but I hate to tell you its a TV sci-fi show.There is nothing real about it. You say Berman and Braga are trying to make Archer a cowboy, did you ever watch TOS? Roddenberry made Kirk the cowboy of his universe. You say we have given you absurd replies, I find that statement absurd. What you post is just your opinion and thats all,we all have opinions and just because we disagree with yours does not make it absurd. I do take offense in that.

 

Enterprise is no different from any other Star Trek shows,every series has had the captain of their vessel or space station up against unsurrmountable odds and have come out victoriuos without being vaporised or losing a key crewmember (With the exception of Jadzia Dax on DS9). Sure there is no realism on Enterprise,there is no realism in any Star Trek show, its all fiction! Its only shown for entertainment value. So I suggest you watch something else and those of that really enjoy Star Trek fiction can sit back and be entertained by a great show with some really great stories.

[ConnorExum 0]

Klingonmike,

 

I didn't say Enteprise was anymore realistic then the rest? No. I said it was just more of the same. Infact I said it was a mish-mosh of past ideas repeated with a new cast in just a flashier way then before. And I get replies that don't even come close to being on the same train of thought as I am. And that really makes me wonder what sort of people are watching today?

 

As to the absurd response read these paraphrased ones. You Klingonmike, say stuff about it's not a military show... Yet the new direction is clearly one of a military direction. Archer isn't out in the Expanse doing peaceful exploration is he? So if that's so shouldn't be alittle more realistic in that area then? On then I got responses about what a fictional public out cry would be to the attack yet that's not what's been disputed here by me. What's disputed here is the realism of the show and premise for whole new direction. How the Xindi attack is what's disputed by me. It simply wasn't a realistic first strike becasue it didn't achieve any meaningful military objective. Digging a trench in Florida isn't a major military objective. Then to self destruct after it's achieved is just crazy. Only an idoit would think a military planner would just throw the enemy examples of his technology to examine. Yet many viewers bought this hook line and sinker which is unfathomable.

 

 

Sure every trek has been the same and isn't that all the more reason to break the mold and of the cowboy in space. Sure in the late '60's and early 70's that was fine for about what 3 seasons then Trek Died??? So I think we can see a distrubing parallel between the two more the cowboyish and predictable the series becomes the less people are willing to watch it. Campy, doesn't work today. It needs to be edgy and realistic with actions that fit the events. Not actions that are designed to be events. I know it's sci-fi but that only means it's got an element of science fiction to explain away what science fact can't today. It doesn't mean you neglect the character development or rational thinking that should take place to develop interesting storylines and characters. Because people connect to the characters not to fictional pieces of technology.

 

 

Take offense all you want...

[ConnorExum 0]

The Xindi "First Strike" is more about creating terror then actually achieving any noticable military objectives. Earth's defenses , government , and general infrstucture are all still intact for the most part. So that leaves Earth able to both potentially defend against another future attack as well to mount a future offensive against the Xindi. Also when the probe self destructed that gave the Starfleet intel boys volumes of information on the enemy(if in reality) and even possible ideas as to the orgin of the probe. The Xindi would be throwing away the key element to any battle plan like this the element of surprise.

These facts about the lacking realism of the new direction can not be disputed from a rational standpoint of storyline development. They however can be over looked by the writers and producers. Which they have been as this far in the series' new direction. Why? I can't tell you exactly nor can I fathom it. Yet too see so many fans of Enterprise being duped into thinking this is some how different then before or better is laughable. Not to mention the fact it's such a reused concept in the Star Trek Saga... When doesn't the crew of some Enterprise save the Earth? Almost every other episode and movie actually it seems at this point.

 

Can we all agree on this Enterprise is nothing but the same old stuff repackaged so far. They've had very few really creative interesting episodes thus far. But they have had bright shinning moments. The question is this why aren't they capitolizing on the strongest elements of the show: character development and showing early developments in Human space flight? I can't understand this at all myself.