Enterprise just rewrites old episodes..

[Stelfan 0]

I have noticed some think that because of Star Treks old age with so many episodes done that there are no new ideas and everything done now are just remakes of what has been done before..

 

I disagree, I think Star Trek is just like wine, it keeps getting better and better the older it gets. And those who create Star Trek have used there experience to make it even better, they are learning more and more about how Star Trek should be, and what we fans want it to be. That's why it keeps going strong.

 

Sure, some episodes can be in one way or the other a remake of some old episode, but they are still great because they have learned to improve these old ideas and in that way improve the episode!

 

What are your opinions?

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

I have noticed some think that because of Star Treks old age with so many episodes done that there are no new ideas and everything done now are just remakes of what has been done before..

These are the same people with no imagination. :lol:

[Sirius 0]

I don't think Enterprise re-writes old episodes.TNG was accused of the same thing.Just because two stories have similar elements,does not make them a rewrite.I'd be interested in an example of the episodes Enterprise allegedly rewrote.

[Captain Bolivar 0]

I agree. Afterall, some soap operas (not that I like them) have been around for more than 25 years. If they can keep going on what little they have, Star Trek can't be doomed, because Star Trek has so much more!

[fredbroca 0]

I have not noticed enterprise ep. copying the other shows I thought that next gen did when they started but not after that I just think if you want to talk about a certian subject it might seem to look like a show that had that same subject matter in it thats all.

[Captain Ericks 0]

There are no doubt elements that are the same. But the TCW episodes are quite distinct and stand on their own, and since they writers got past the puddle of puke that was season one, Enterprise has been very good.

[Red Shirt Volunteer 0]

There's no problem using classic storylines or conflicts, but let's not be too optimistic. Although I thought "Dawn" was a decent episode to help develop Trip's character a bit, it was a blantant rip-off of stories that have been seen before in TNG and the filme, "Enemy Mine." There have been a few other eps I'm sure, but I can't be bothered listing them. Since no eps were listed in the previous posts here indicating where people had claimed they were rip-offs then explaining why they weren't, I don't really feel like putting much effort into stating why some of them are.

 

Basically, I think it's fine if they reuse the general structure and conflicts of old plots, but when there are too many similarities, it's just lame writing. How many times did we see Archer get captured? I think everyone got a little tired of that scenario after a while, and it was just the first 2 seasons. I'm not saying I don't like Ent because I actually think it's the best all-around series I've seen so far, but let's not completely ignore its weaknesses.

[Son_worshiper 0]

Name one science fiction show in the last 40-years that Can't be conected to some other sci-fi or fantasy before it,and I'll eat my hat,redshirt volunteer.

Its all very perspective,when it comes to saying this show or that book is a rip-off of some other thing.You see connections between "Dawn" and another,earlier show or shows.I don't.

In my opinion,Enterprise is not now,nor ever has "ripped off" a storyline from another show or movie or book or song or whatever else there is.

As has been said already on this topic,simply because some shows have an air of familiarity about them does not in itself mean that the story is copying anything.

Edited November 5, 2003 by Son_worshiper

[Red Shirt Volunteer 0]

The question isn't about every other sci-fi show, it's about Ent and its place in the Star Trek as far as originality goes - so please try to stay on topic. I didn't say it stole ideas on a regular basis, I said there have been a few episodes that were a little lacking on creativity. I said I like the show and most eps are good, but don't go saying every one is brand new. Come off it. Have you even seen "Enemy Mine?" It's fairly blatant. I'm not saying it was a bad episode, it was fine - but nothing special and certainly nothing creative.

 

What's the point of this thread anyway? Nobody's brought up one single example of evidence except me. For goodness sake, at least argue what elements of the episode of "Dawn" were original. Do I have to make a comprehensive list? I feel I must request that you at least back up what you're saying with something more than your opinion. The thing is, for younger viewers I can see how it would seem original; but, for those of us who have seen our share of sci-fi, it was a pretty weak attempt. If you tried to pass something like this off as academic work, you'd probably be expelled (from any decent university) if the makers of "Enemy Mine" weren't given credit for the idea. I'm open to the idea that "Enemy Mine" even got the idea from elsewhere, but that's not the point because it just adds to the unoriginal nature of it.

 

I don't even expect Ent to be completely original. There should be some classic elements in it to help link it with themes from TOS and the other history we know of Starfleet, etc.

[Yellow_Dragon 0]

Son_worshiper WAS on topic,redshirt.Don't get bent out of shape because he disagrees with you.So do I.

Enterprise is not lacking in creativity.If anything,the shows have been getting better and better.I don't see your problem.Is it that you just don't like Enterprise?Then why post in the Enterprise forum?

Lately quite a few people have been showing signs of really short temper around here,and frankly I'm getting a little tired of it.If you can't post with a little civility,don't post.

[Goose 0]

Stardate:213847.3

 

 

Yeh man lighten up jeessh :lol:

 

 

 

I have seen a little bit of ideas from other Star Trek being used again but unlike some people I just dont give a sh!t.If its a good episode and written well thats all i care about

[Red Shirt Volunteer 0]

Whatever. I said in my orginal post that I like the show - did you bother to read it? I tried to post something substantial and I didn't get angry at all. I would just like to see a response with some detail in it instead of blindly cheering on Ent. I've said elsewhere that I do like it, so that's why I post here, and not at startrek.com where it was a wasteland of complaining. If you can't reply to critique, what am I supposed to do? There's not much point in posting and discussing it if people aren't even willing to see it from more than one point of view. I don't see anything in my post lacking civility - I'm not willing to compromise what I believe based on a comments like "Lighten up." And really, is there any need for you guys to jump all over me and attack what I said. The last 2 posts have had almost nothing to do with the topic or added very little to it. If you have a problem with my posts, show some tact and send a PM to me or the Admin.

 

I've also said elsewhere that I thought Ent was improving of late in other areas. Am I not allowed to have a different opinion on different aspects of the program?

Edited November 5, 2003 by Red Shirt Volunteer

[B4_ 0]

Well,I'm new here.

Hello.

And maybe I shouldn't be jumping into the middle of all this.But,my friend,redshirt volunteer,is it?Your last post seems,to me at least,to be very uncivil in tone.What you've said about being able to see something from all points pertains to you,too.

Obviously,most of the people who have responded do not feel the way you do.They have given there reasons.If you don't think their reasons are thought out well enough,what can I say?Drop the subject and move on.What will ranting get you?

[Guest bella]

From a slightly different perspective, it is possible to have exactly the same 'script' and still be original: look at all the nuances that can be brought out in a single Shakespeare play. No one production is the same as another, and they reveal different truths about humankind and the world.

 

I'm not saying that Enetrprise is on a par with Shakespeare of course, but even with a similar plot, there are enough changes in the cast of characters and how they interact to give it its own spin on things.

 

"Enemy Mine" and "Dawn" are similar, I admit, but no other examples spring to mind.

[A l t e r E g o 9]

I see nothing "uncivil" with the tone of R_S_V posts even after being (IMO)attacked for posting an [on topic] opinion but I'll let the Mod of this forum deal with that.

 

Plenty of Trek episodes are based on earlier ideas, every time you see an episode based on a transporter accident, that is a rehash of TOS episode The Enemy Within Season 1 #5.

 

Read almost any of the episode synopsis from the reference books Captains Logs or a series Companion and you will see time and time again the story is somehow based on some work of literature or, is re-telling of an earlier episode of Trek with a new spin on the idea. Of the story Exile, Rick Berman himself said; Its Beauty and the Beast. :lol:

[poguemahone 0]

***MOD NOTE***

In my opinion all post in this thread have been on topic, please refrain from attacking members, and to not turn this thread in to a off topic argument

 

Back to the topic, basic plot lines always are rehashed from older stories its pretty hard to come up with new ideas. Enterprise is becoming my favorite Star Trek Series, if it were copied word for word I'd have a problem with it. Enterprise is just good trek, using the time tested formula.

[Red Shirt Volunteer 0]

Essentially that's what I'm saying. I feel the reuse of classic stories can be a good thing in establishing that connection to TOS or what we already know about the Trek universe. It's hard for any writer to come up with completely unique material. Besides, if they did, it would likely be lost on many of us because it wouldn't connect with our experiences or the program in general. The seies is among the best that Trek has offered in my opinion.

 

On the other hand, I do feel there has been a certain level of repetition in Ent we haven't seen before. This is probably due to the fact that it's a prequel and that we've had so much other Trek in recent years (continuous (I think) since TNG through Voyager). A few of the episodes have been a tad, shall we say, reminiscent of things I've seen before a few too many times.

 

The problem for the writers is to remain true to the spirit of the show and use the classic stories that are easy to understand and can draw in new fans; however, they also simultaneously have to appeal to those of us who've seen a lot of Trek and want some surprises. I'd say they're doing a very good job in general, but don't quite get it together right on the occasional episode. Season 3 appears to be moving in the right direction and getting away from this pattern so far.

 

Just so nobody thinks this is only my opinion, here's another thread where other people state basically the same thing, interspersed with some colourful commentary about Trip's appearance:

 

An old thread on "Dawn"

Edited November 6, 2003 by Red Shirt Volunteer

[Stelfan 0]

Enterprise is just good trek, using the time tested formula.

Exactly my opinion. They use the things that work and have now with their broad experience learned to make it even better.

[Klingonmike 0]

Every kind of form of entertainment goes by a formula, sitcoms have a formula that is re-used over and over Sci-Fi also has a formula that can be re-used over and over. The ART is to re-use this formula and make it unique to that episode. I've seen simularities in all the Star Trek series. TOS had a couple of episodes that reminded me of Lost in Space episodes and Outer Limits episodes. TNG most certainly used a few old TOS episodes and re-hashed them to make them their own. Its all about taking a formula that works well and making it your own.

 

"Dawn" was used as an example, although there are a couple of simularities to the film "Enemy Mine" it was done in a way that was completely different from the film. For me the only thing that made "Dawn" like the film was there was a human and an alien stranded on a planet and they kept trying to kill or fight each other and eventually they became friends,somewhat.The journey that took us thru the episode is what made the difference between it and the film and of course it ended totally different than the film ended.

There is an art to rehashing story lines and Enterprise has some great 'artist' writing these stories.