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How super freaked out would you be if...

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So what if you woke up from a coma and laying next to you in your clone. And the doctor says "By the way, in order to save you we had to create your double and then kill him. Time for his funeral now" I know I'd be super freaked out and very guilty. How bout you guys?

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Trip's emotions would probably be like a roller coaster. I hope that's at least touched upon. However, he has nothing to feel guilty about because he didn't do anything wrong. The ship would have blown up if he hadn't shut down the reactor and the accident wasn't even his fault. His modifications were working until Enterprise flew into the previously undetected space crud. Who fell asleep at the sensor station or was the crud undetectable? I'm sure he'd feel creeped out by the saga of Sim but I'd expect Trip to experience insecurity more than anything else. Could I have been replaced? Think about it. How would that make you feel? :clap: I would feel terrible. That's why I liked Archer's resentment of Sim's assumptions that he could stay in Trip's quarters; it showed that Trip would never be replaced in Archer's heart no matter what. That's nice, isn't it? :clap:

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I thought that final shot of Trip at the funeral was the perfect ending - someone he never knew died to save him...because that person thought he was necessary to save the world. Talk about a major responsibility - now he has to live to make that person's sacrifice worthwhile. He may not have asked for it but that's some heavy stuff.

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No guilt trip for me, I would feel sympathy for them forced to make the choices but since I had no part in making the choices I would have nothing to feel guilty about. I hope that is the angle they play up with Trip, sympathetic to Archer but not exhibiting guilt for Sims death.

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Trip's emotions would probably be like a roller coaster.  I hope that's at least touched upon.  However, he has nothing to feel guilty about because he didn't do anything wrong.  The ship would have blown up if he hadn't shut down the reactor and the accident wasn't even his fault.  His modifications were working until Enterprise flew into the previously undetected space crud.  Who fell asleep at the sensor station or was the crud undetectable? I'm sure he'd feel creeped out by the saga of Sim but I'd expect Trip to experience insecurity more than anything else. Could I have been replaced?  Think about it.  How would that make you feel? :laugh:    I would feel terrible.  That's why I liked Archer's resentment of Sim's assumptions that he could stay in Trip's quarters; it showed that Trip would never be replaced in Archer's heart no matter what.  That's nice,  isn't it?  :laugh:

 

I thought that final shot of Trip at the funeral was the perfect ending - someone he never knew died to save him...because that person thought he was necessary to save the world.  Talk about a major responsibility - now he has to live to make that person's sacrifice worthwhile.  He may not have asked for it but that's some heavy stuff.

 

I agree with you both.

However IMO it would be very strange at the very least to look down into a coffin and see "myself."

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So what if you woke up from a coma and laying next to you in your clone. And the doctor says "By the way, in order to save you we had to create your double and then kill him. Time for his funeral now" I know I'd be super freaked out and very guilty.  How bout you guys?

I think I'd go through feelings of guilt and confusion, at least for a period of time. ( But I'd also have to get back to work!) And he is still going to have to deal with some of the things Sim did, particularly with T'Pol. To me at the funeral he looked a bit "out of it." If it were me my mind would be swimming with feelings of remorse, curiosity, guilt, and confusion, no matter how glad I was to still be in the land of the living.

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I have to agree that it would cause mixed emotions, first to know that someone had to give their life to save mine, second to know that that person could possibly have replaced me. Also it is discomforting to know that the individual had my memories and passed some of my private feelings on to others.

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A roller coaster indeed. Trip would run the gamut, but the way he's been presented so far insecurity seems to be part of his make up. Unsure why women would find him attractive, wondering if people talk about him (The Crossing when he was in decon and Phlox turned off the P.A), not at all arrogant the way engineers tend to be. I think he'd feel sympathy for this unknown person who saved him but I think on the inside he'd be ungodly insecure. I've read at least six on-line reviews that were so analytical they asked, "Weren't Trip and Sim the same person?"

 

One even went so far as to call it a stream of consciousness transfer. Another...."Trip wouldn't be dead. Weren't they one and the same anyway?" These people aren't meaning that a part of Trip would live on. They're literally implying that Trip dying wouldn't have been a real death because the two men were completely interchangeable. Three of them asked "Why was Archer that upset?"

 

I don't know about any of you, but the idea that anyone could ever imply that two human souls have no unique worth, imply that one person could be completely interchangeable with another is the most ludicrous and profoundly insensitive notion I can conceive of. How can you possibly think of two human souls as being interchangeable? That your friends could accept another "you" as if it were no big deal? That Archer is a b@stard for not being capable of throwing his arms around Sim and giving him a big kiss? (I've read the words "murderer, ""atrocity" and "bastard" bandied about by these reviewers in regard to Archer) Your parents welcome the new "you" home from the dangerous space voyage Your children calling someone else "mommy" or "daddy." I know six or seven reviews and a few posters on various BBS's aren't the whole of Trek fandom but is anyone as saddened as I am that anyone could possibly not "get" that Trip and Sim were two individuals with unique value and worth in spite of shared memories? With two souls? That Sim living on wouldn't mean that Trip wasn't dead? That Trip living on doesn't mean that Sim isn't dead? Does it make anyone as queasy as it makes me that such questions could even be asked? :( Or am I just strange? :( :(

 

I can imagine Trip being deeply wounded if he heard people on the ship whispering such questions. I can imagine him keeping it stoically to himself but being haunted by insecurity that Sim would have lived on and taken his place in the hearts of his friends, maybe even resent him for being so noble at the very end, thus riddling Trip with insecurities. It seems classic for his personality. If one of the writers caught wind of these insensitive remarks by some of the BBS crowd they could write a story for Trip that Trinneer could hit out of the ballpark and make the people who asked those questions feel like the insensitive ninnies they are. :dude: Sounds like a winner.

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So what if you woke up from a coma and laying next to you in your clone. And the doctor says "By the way, in order to save you we had to create your double and then kill him. Time for his funeral now" I know I'd be super freaked out and very guilty. How bout you guys?

This question reminds me of the movie "The Island". Good movie, Neelix is in it too.

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I just had the thought that it would be a little confusing. If I were told that the clone had my memories and such, how would I know for certain that I was not the clone and that the real me was not the one that had died?

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So what if you woke up from a coma and laying next to you in your clone. And the doctor says "By the way, in order to save you we had to create your double and then kill him. Time for his funeral now" I know I'd be super freaked out and very guilty. How bout you guys?

This question reminds me of the movie "The Island". Good movie, Neelix is in it too.

 

But they did inform Trip's clone that he was a clone fairly soon, and that he would be short lived. They were far more honest, and were actually dealing with the moral implications of their choice to grow the clone, even as the process was moving forward.

 

In 'The Island', there was a whole culture of deception, and the people who purchased the clones to start with were selfish, with no consideration that their clones were actually human.

 

Both the Enterprise episode, and the movie searched out the moral issues well...both were quite good. In neither setting did things actually get 'settled.'

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So what if you woke up from a coma and laying next to you in your clone. And the doctor says "By the way, in order to save you we had to create your double and then kill him. Time for his funeral now" I know I'd be super freaked out and very guilty. How bout you guys?

This question reminds me of the movie "The Island". Good movie, Neelix is in it too.

 

But they did inform Trip's clone that he was a clone fairly soon, and that he would be short lived. They were far more honest, and were actually dealing with the moral implications of their choice to grow the clone, even as the process was moving forward.

 

In 'The Island', there was a whole culture of deception, and the people who purchased the clones to start with were selfish, with no consideration that their clones were actually human.

 

Both the Enterprise episode, and the movie searched out the moral issues well...both were quite good. In neither setting did things actually get 'settled.'

Yeah, totally different situations. The Island just came to mind when I read the post. Anyone that hasn't seen it should get it and watch it.

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I just had the thought that it would be a little confusing. If I were told that the clone had my memories and such, how would I know for certain that I was not the clone and that the real me was not the one that had died?

 

Hears Twilight Zone theme song....

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Would make for an touching movie if Trip was an clone. Now imagine if Phlox was the clone...dun dun dun :congrats:

 

But, if Trip was a Clone...and I think clones have such short lifespans cause no one seems to have perfect technology back then in pre-Kirk era...

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So what if you woke up from a coma and laying next to you in your clone. And the doctor says "By the way, in order to save you we had to create your double and then kill him. Time for his funeral now" I know I'd be super freaked out and very guilty. How bout you guys?

This question reminds me of the movie "The Island". Good movie, Neelix is in it too.

 

I'd be completely freaked out (and horrified) in that situation! It would probably give me nightmares.

 

Also, I would definitely give "The Island" > :congrats::notworthy:

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Uhhh...i'd be feeling weird, to be sure. Two of me-could the world stand the strain!? Grin. No, I am not so bad as all that! I guess I would feel, in a way...man, that's a toughie! Great question, though. Sounds like a good psych paper! Would I mourn?..part of me-or a me-killed. Wow.

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