Takara_Soong 4 Posted October 18, 2003 I have seen very little DS9 which had the most interaction with Cardassians of any of the Trek series. The Cardassians that I saw on TNG seemed to have no redeeming qualities. In "The Wounded" two of the Cardassians seemed decent but most were portrayed as being warmongers, vicious and cruel, almost savage, in their ways. The torture of Picard in Chain of Command, the torture and execution of Bajorans are but two examples. Even in The Chase, the Cardassians were unable to open their eyes to the message that was given. What do you think? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Bolivar 0 Posted October 18, 2003 In Deep Space Nine, the Cardassians are portrayed in a mostly negative way throughout the entire series. But if you want to know why I think they have redeeming qualities, you'll have to check out my spoiler. It will spoil some of DS9 for you. Click for Spoiler: In Deep Space Nine, the Cardassians are portrayed in a mostly negative way thoughout the entire series. They even ally with the Breen and the Dominion and wreak havoc upon the Federation, the Klingons, the Rommies, and many other people. But the Cardies were led into this alliance by Gul Dukat, a poor leader. Eventually, they come to realize that the alliance is bad for them... and eventually fight back and switch sides, helping the Federation defeat the Dominion. It is mostly the Cardassian military, and the Obsidian order that presents us with the bad Cardies... the rest are actually quite decent I think. For me, the Cardassian military rulers were equivalent to the Nazi's which explains their system of justice and their occupation of the Bajorans. Like in Nazi Germany, it was the military and the rulers that were bad, not the people. That is just how I interpret the Cardassians. Feel free to disagree! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VaBeachGuy 12 Posted October 18, 2003 You really need to see more DS9. Gul Dukat is one of the most interesting "Bad Guys" of any Star Trek series. He goes from being "Bad Guy" to "Almost Good Guy" to "Good Guy" and back to "Bad Guy" then finally in the end "Pure Evil Guy". His is one of the most compelling characters to come along in a while. Another Cardassian, one of my favorite characters is Elim Garak. Garak has to be the most interesting of all the Cardies we meet. You are never quite sure if he's a bad guy or a good guy but you like him all the same. He's the kind of character that you would want to be your friend and would hate to have as your enemy. You get the feeling that even as your friend he wouldn't blink twice to betray you but yet you trust him implicitly. Another compelling Cardassian was only seen in 2 episodes, Legate Ghemor (the one on the left). Here we see him in "Second Skin" where Kira is kidnapped and taken to Cardassia Prime, then altered to look Cardassian. She is told that Legate Ghemor is her real father and that she is in fact a Cardassian agent that was altered to look Bajoran and she was given the memories of a real Bajoran that was killed. Later in the series we see Ghemor again in "Ties of Blood and Water" He makes a very compelling character. Then there's Damar, who goes from being Dukats lackey to puppet leader of the Cardassians (Weyoun's lackey) and finally to savior and hero of the Cardassian people. There were other great Cardassian episodes and characters but I think these highlight the bright spots. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LadyNarana 0 Posted October 19, 2003 I don't know as I fully agree with the statement that Dukat was a poor leader. He made poor decisions, yes, but one doesn't necessarily follow the other. I have to think about that... I love Cardassians. It's no secret that Marc Alaimo and Andy Robinson are two of my favorite ST actors of all time because of Dukat and Garak. I've seen the TNG episodes, and you're right, they seem to have no sympathetic qualities at all. (Although MA gets his first Cardie role on TNG.) I don't know as they had the time or story space to show too much else. Too, if I'm thinking correctly, the TNG episodes are taking place during the withdrawal from Bajor. I don't know as anyone in the Cardassian Union was too happy during that time. (I know - that's Monday morning quarterbacking - but it fits!) It's when you move into DS9 and their species role is fleshed out that you see more of the other sides to them. Tain, as I see him, had no redeeming qualities, really, other than a good wit. Garak you're never sure (and you love trying to figure it out). Dukat - well, the best description of him I can think of is "every villain is the hero of his own story." That's the way MA played him, IMO, and it complicated and broadened what started out as just another bad guy. Ghemor - you could sympathize with him. He was a great view into the softer side of Cardie. Ziyal, too. Good Cardie episodes...hm...Second Skin. Ties of Blood and Water. The Wire. The two when Garak rejoins Tain (The Die is Cast and the other one. ). The two in the POW camp...good insight into Garak. Indiscretion and Return to Grace have always been two I enjoyed. Have to think about others... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VaBeachGuy 12 Posted October 19, 2003 Good overview on the Cardassians. Tain, as I see him, had no redeeming qualities, really, other than a good wit. I think he redeemed himself to a degree in the end (By Inferno's Light). He made peace with Elim and showed that the leader of the Obsidian Order did indeed have a bit of a softer side, just a bit. Ghemor - you could sympathize with him. He was a great view into the softer side of Cardie. You could definately feel for him, especially when he comes back in his second episode. I won't give any details from that episode here but it was a great one. I'll save details for a future Episode Spotlight. Ziyal, too. You really had to feel for her, having Dukat as a father and her Bajoran mother dead. Not accepted by either race but longing to have a connection to both. I was really disappointed in the way they "resolved" this character. Good Cardie episodes...hm...Second Skin. Ties of Blood and Water. The Wire. The two when Garak rejoins Tain (The Die is Cast and the other one. ). The two in the POW camp...good insight into Garak. Indiscretion and Return to Grace have always been two I enjoyed. Have to think about others... All of these were great episodes, I've done Episode Spotlights for several of them and have plans to do ones for the others as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theunicornhunter 2 Posted October 19, 2003 The only redeeming quality that I can think of is that Cardassians love their children - that was mentioned in a couple of different episodes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LadyNarana 0 Posted October 19, 2003 The only redeeming quality that I can think of is that Cardassians love their children - that was mentioned in a couple of different episodes. And yet they leave behind the war orphans and kill the half-bloods. I wonder how they rectify that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mr.Picard 12 Posted October 19, 2003 Well, I must admit that I haven't seen much of DS9 yet, I am currently watching season 4 (or season 5???) episodes on TV here. But my fave char on DS9 is a Cardassian, so I think I should say something about them Garak is my fave char, you never know whether he is good or bad. I loved the episode "Our man Bashir" (he looked good in that suit :) ). And, to say something about the Cardassians in general, I totally understand ensign Ro that she hates them for what they have done to her father. They seem to be extremely violent and all that, I don't like that very much Mrs. Captain Picard Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VaBeachGuy 12 Posted October 19, 2003 The only redeeming quality that I can think of is that Cardassians love their children - that was mentioned in a couple of different episodes. I think they have more redeeming qualities then just a love of family. For the most part we only see the military and usually we see them in times that they are the enemy of the Federation. We know almost nothing about their non-military culture though. What we have seen of the non-military Cardassians has been, for the most part good though. There was Gilora and Ulani, the scientists that aided in making communication through the wormhole possible in "Destiny". I know there were a couple of other instances where we see positive things from the Cardassians too but mostly they were used as the "bad guys". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VaBeachGuy 12 Posted October 19, 2003 Garak is my fave char, you never know whether he is good or bad. I loved the episode "Our man Bashir" (he looked good in that suit ). Here you go :) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mr.Picard 12 Posted October 19, 2003 Thank you, VBG, I loved this episode :) Mrs. Captain Picard Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nipples_The_Clown 0 Posted October 23, 2003 If they do,this unemployed,disgruntled,mentally-imbalanced clown hasn't seen them.... Take Garak :blink: ,that guy was capable of anything.He scared me. Most other Cardassians did too.They were too close to being nazi's for my comfort.... Yeeesh... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Goose 0 Posted October 26, 2003 Stardate:213816.9 I loved the Cardassians.Gul Dukat IMO was the best villian Star Trek has ever had and one of the best characters good or bad.Garak was my favorite DS9 cahracter and one of my favorite all time characters.And i think that the cardassians won the war for the Federation at the end. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
B4_ 0 Posted November 5, 2003 (edited) Sure. Just like people all over the world who live in country's with brutal,militaristic government,the Cardassian people are not what they seem.We often fear the government and automatically catagorize all of that governments people as the enemy,and as savages.This usually isn't the case at all. I think the ordinary Cardassian isn't so very much different than the ordinary Human,or Bajoran in temperment and desire.They are a simple,spiritual people.I'm sure they detested their leadership as much as the bajorans did.Both people were terrorized by that government's shocktroops and secret police,after all. The Cardassians who did seem merciless were either soldiers or younger Cardassians who had,most likely,been brainwashed from childhood to hold the government more dearly than their own family(a common enough practice among tyrannical government's). I believe there were many instances on DS9 of individual Cardassians showing good character and many admirable traits.Even garak! I wouldn't be surprised to see a Cardassian Starfleet officer in the future. Edited November 5, 2003 by B4_ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sirius 0 Posted November 7, 2003 I thought it would have been much more interesting casting the bajorans as the bad guys,and the Cardassians as the oppressed.But,by the time DS9 came about,we had already been introduced to both species on TNG and the dye was cast. It all seemed rather bigoted that the most human-looking of the two species should be savaged by the more alien-looking people. In answer to the topic question,yes,I believe the Cardasians had redeeming qualities about them.Certain Cardassians have displayed kindness,courage,self sacrafice,and valor.I liked Damar,very much.Garak,as well. :o Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Crewman_Parrish 0 Posted November 12, 2003 Wow,this question is tougher than I thought.I've written and deleted four responses now.I'm having a little trouble putting my thoughts into words.I suppose,what I want to say basically is yes,Cardassians have redeeming qualities.I saw examples of selflessness and loyalty from Garak,and even in Damar,there at the end...even if his devotion was more to Cardassia than anything else.For a while I Thought Dukat was a great man.I started to feel that maybe in his own way he did think that he had done the things he had done (as commander of Terok Nor),for the good of both the Cardassians and the Bajorans,and that deep down he was a man of principles,willing to fight for his beliefs,etc.But then as his true nature became more and more self-evident,I admitted to myself that he was nothing more than a cold-blooded Nazi.It was disappointing because I had liked the whole triangle between Dukat-Ziyal-and Kira.Dukat and Nerys had had some great moments together. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VaBeachGuy 12 Posted November 12, 2003 For a while I Thought Dukat was a great man.I started to feel that maybe in his own way he did think that he had done the things he had done (as commander of Terok Nor),for the good of both the Cardassians and the Bajorans,and that deep down he was a man of principles,willing to fight for his beliefs,etc. That's what made Dukat such a great villain, you couldn't be sure to feel sorry for him, like him or hate him until the very end. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cardie Fan 0 Posted November 23, 2003 The Cardassian people have always been among the more civilized of the galaxy's myriad peoples.Cardassians place a high value on their literature,music,art,and science.Cardassians are spiritual and peace loving,and have made many examples of selflessly helping their less fortunate neighbors....though the kindness of Cardassia has often been sadly mistaken for weakness and "empire building",when in fact it was just the opposite. :lol: Cardassians have proven themselves loyal,hard working,accomplished warriors,and talented engineers. It is a mark of pride amongst Cardassians that their civilization continued to flourish through the hardships and societal anarchy before the military came to power and restored balance and justice to the homeworld.In just a short while the Cardassian people went from a resource poor,impoverished pre-warp society to a power to be reckoned with in the alpha quadrant,with outposts on worlds they hadn't known only a century before!All Cardassia is grateful to its military. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krell 0 Posted January 7, 2004 I am a Cardassian... My loyalty is for Cardassia The Cardassians are good people and no one can change that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lursa 0 Posted January 12, 2005 The Cardassians are an interesting race of people who founded their society in black and white. While being miltary at heart it is really cool to have races like that on Star Trek. Alot of people think that they are a bad race. In reality, they are like alot like the Bajorians expect they are more hard-headed at times lol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhostofMajorHayes 10 Posted September 8, 2007 I think if there is one thing that they have proven time and again it is that they (Cardassians) are very passionate about their beliefs and that they will fight and die for what they believe in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites