Sign in to follow this  
A l t e r E g o

The Temporal Cold War

Recommended Posts

Allot of people never seemed to understand what the TCW was about, many thought it was about destroying the timeline as we knew it, that it tried to "reset' history onto a new timeline but they were wrong imo, it was about creating it.

 

I believe Archers knowledge of future events (attacks on the past) would have become one of the major reasons for forming the Federation in the first place.

 

The irony of this theory is that it reveals the entire timeline as we know it to be is actually a changed timeline; the attackers succeeded in the plan to change history, they changed it into the timeline we know. Getting a headache yet? B) It's really simple as long as you don't over think it.

 

Unfortunately the original course of the arc was changed near the end of the series becoming a tale about Nazi Guy (:blink:) after the producers figured out (because of criticisms) that few understood or appreciated what that arc was going to accomplish in the long run.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The biggest problem with the temporal cold war was that it was thrown in at the insistence of UPN. They wanted something futuristic (because apparently a starship set 150 years in the future isn't futuristic). Berman and Braga did not have time to adequately develop the storyline. Which is why it comes across as a bit of a jumbled mess. I'm not saying I don't like the TCW, but without network interference, the show would have been better received (without the ad-hoc nature of the storyline).

 

I did had some cool ideas about the Future Guy Silik was talking to. I had the thought that what if in 2155, he travelled back in time and landed in New Jersey. He is attacked by Berlinghoff Rasmussen and in the struggle Rasmussen steals his ship and when the future guy is found (as he is Romulan, but thought by humans to be Vulcan) it appears he murdered Rasmussen which becomes a rallying point for Terra Prime.

 

Then you throw Archer in there because Rasmussen was his roommate at MIT (a concept abandoned for an early episode) and then Future guy insists he's from the future and so Archer is brought in to talk to him. You could probably have some wicked interrogation scenes in there as FG explains why he did what he did. And then he escapes or tries to kill Archer and so Daniels comes back and saves Archer and arrests Future Guy.

 

Of course it would be crucial to make sure Starfleet security never releases Rasmussen's name, so there is no way the Ent-D crew would recognize it.

 

This is what I do in my spare time, come up with crazy plots for Enterprise Season 5. If I ever manage to get the whole season planned out, I may write it but I'll at least post the outline.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought it was pretty clear.

 

The Federation Temporal Agents weren't trying to change the timeline at all. They were trying to maintain it. Which, in itself, is a good strategy when facing hostile temporal opponents. They were all trying to change time to suit there purposes. It seems to me that the FTAs adopted a strategy of "Why change time to thwart our opponents when we can simply keep time as it is?" Doing so would, of course, prevent enemy TAs from succeeding in their plans.

 

Of course, this in itself leads to a paradox... If enemy TAs changed the past, how would FTAs of an unaltered future be aware of it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just think there were a lot of short sighted 'fans' that couldn't see the direction that the series was going in. They couldn't see the potential that the series had and the stories that were just around the corner.

 

I can't think of a single episode of Enterprise that I didn't like, and that includes "A Night in Sickbay". The development of the Vulcans was great, a lot of people were up in arms because "Vulcans wouldn't act that way" or because T'Pol didn't act like Spock or Tuvok. They didn't take into account that this was 100 years before Spock and Tuvok's time.

 

Also, the development of the Andorians was awesome. Shran became one of my favorite characters and his story was one of the things I looked the most forward to for seasons 5 through 7.

 

There was just so much left to do when the show ended, so many great stories left untold. It's a shame.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The development of the Vulcans was great, a lot of people were up in arms because "Vulcans wouldn't act that way" or because T'Pol didn't act like Spock or Tuvok. They didn't take into account that this was 100 years before Spock and Tuvok's time.

I agree.

 

When you think about it, how can Spock really be used as a benchmark for how Vulcans should act when he was half-human? Because of that he may have worked harder than a full blooded Vulcan to keep his emotions under control so that he was even less emotional than the average Vulcan really was. And there were times in TOS when Spock was quite emotional.

 

As for Tuvok, he had his own struggles with emotions. In the Voyager episode Gravity we saw flashbacks to Tuvok's teen years when he was sent to a Vulcan Master because he didn't want to control his emotions.

 

And then we have Sybok who showed that even in Spock's time there were Vulcans who didn't practice the repressing of emotions.

Edited by Takara_Soong

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Strangely speaking I actually posed this question in www.startrek.com's message board on Enterprise and I just didn't understand the whole concept of it. In most respects it did look as if it was thrown in at the last minute with no clear/adequate explanation of what the war was about -

 

(1) Who are the good guys and who are the bad guys ?

 

(2) How do we know Daniel is a good guy ?

 

(3) who was the other future guy ?

 

(4) If temporal changes took place how did future-Starfleet know they had taken place ?

 

In many ways it left more questions than it answered and generally left many fans confused and switching channels to another programme such as Stargate SG-1 which had an easier to understand premise

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

it has been a few months since I have even watched ENT (I need to go watch the entire series again since I own all of them, love it!) So I will try to answer most of your questions to the best of my memory and what I can remember.

 

1) Who are the good guys and who are the bad guys? In the future, there are different factions. All of them trying to change the past to benefit things to their advantage. One example being the Suliban trying to cause the Klingon Empire to go into a civil war. But the faction that Daniels works for, the United Federation of Planets of his century, have a Temporal Prime Directive that has rules and also tries to prevent others from changing the past to the best of their abilities, but sometimes require help from people of the past to stop the changes from taking place. The 22nd Century was a major time for the Cold War and the Enterprise is accidentally swept into a battle they never planned to fight

 

2) How do we know Daniels is a good guy ? He is from the future Starfleet, so we can assume he is good. Not to mention he has only done good with no evil intentions on the show

 

3) who was the other future guy ? Future Guy is the leader of the Suliban Faction in the 29th century and would supply the Suliban with weapons to help change history, like causing the Klingon Empire to go into civil war as said above in another answer

 

 

 

I hope that answers some of your questions. I liked the Temporal arch, but it's hard to remember since I haven't seen it in a while, gotta watch it again!!! :look:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How is this a cold war?

There is no open conflict, just factions attempting to undermine the history of other factions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How is this a cold war?

 

Thats easy the weather's gotten decidedly dodgy in the future hence.

 

Also nobody has answered my question 4 - How did future-starfleet know that there had been temporal changes ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How is this a cold war?

 

Thats easy the weather's gotten decidedly dodgy in the future hence.

 

Also nobody has answered my question 4 - How did future-starfleet know that there had been temporal changes ?

They must have some form of temporal shielding similar to the alternate Voyager in Year of Hell.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How is this a cold war?

 

Thats easy the weather's gotten decidedly dodgy in the future hence.

 

Also nobody has answered my question 4 - How did future-starfleet know that there had been temporal changes ?

They must have some form of temporal shielding similar to the alternate Voyager in Year of Hell.

 

A B&B solution to everything as Scotty would say "I cannae re-write the laws of physics" well in this case B&B did just that because it suited them - Einstein was probably rolling in his grave after having heard of this pile of crap

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Also nobody has answered my question 4 - How did future-starfleet know that there had been temporal changes ?

 

In Future's End, Part II Braxton said that they could scan time

Edited by mowzer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know how many of herein has noticed, but there's been a Time War in the series of Doctor Who that resulted in virtual extinction of the Time Lords and their planet save for him (The Doctor...).

 

According to Wikipedia, it seems that his wiping out ten million Dalek warships during the war led to this demise..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know how many of herein has noticed, but there's been a Time War in the series of Doctor Who that resulted in virtual extinction of the Time Lords and their planet save for him (The Doctor...).

 

According to Wikipedia, it seems that his wiping out ten million Dalek warships during the war led to this demise..

 

 

But the thing is this was not a recurring theme in the show - whereas in ENT it was and left many confused by the whole thing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also nobody has answered my question 4 - How did future-starfleet know that there had been temporal changes ?

 

Archer would have reported what Silik told him about having saved the 01 from destruction, that became historical fact, (though kept secret.) Starfleet knew all along they were living in an altered timeline so future Starfleets directive in this matter became one of preserving what had happened, making sure the changed timeline stayed intact because their present depended on it.

 

Hi everyone

 

I have a 5th question - How did future-starfleet know the changes were bad ?

 

The changes were bad in the sense Starfleet knew they were living in a altered timeline but that could not be helped. When the 01 was saved no one had the ability to go back in time and stop Silik from saving it. By the time they do have that ability it became a question of 'should they?' Doing so would have repaired the timeline but would have changed their reality, perhaps destroying the path of millions, billions of people which lived in the altered timeline.

 

I can't blame them for allowing the altered timeline to continue, perhaps that decision is where the line: "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" sprang from.

 

 

I don't know how many of herein has noticed, but there's been a Time War in the series of Doctor Who that resulted in virtual extinction of the Time Lords and their planet save for him (The Doctor...).

 

According to Wikipedia, it seems that his wiping out ten million Dalek warships during the war led to this demise..

 

 

But the thing is this was not a recurring theme in the show - whereas in ENT it was and left many confused by the whole thing

 

B&B wrote many time travel stories in the previous series and imo proved they knew what they were doing when it came to them. The TCW arc could have ended up being their crowning achievement if it were not for the impatience and reliance of preconceived notions of what ENT should have been by most of the "fans."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the only pre-conceived notion held by the fans was for arcs that could deliver something worth watching. The Temporal Cold War failed to fulfill those expectations. Blaming the fans for losing interest in a storyline, I think is misguided. The fault lies with the writers. Rick Berman I'm sure might think "my work is great and the fans just don't appreciate my brilliance", after all this is a man who doesn't understand why Nemesis failed. But if the correct reasons for the failure of a storyline, and series, are not identified, then improvements can never be made. Rather than expecting the fans to conform to the storylines, the writers have to raise their game and provide material that can hold the interest of the viewers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the only pre-conceived notion held by the fans was for arcs that could deliver something worth watching. The Temporal Cold War failed to fulfill those expectations. Blaming the fans for losing interest in a storyline, I think is misguided. The fault lies with the writers. Rick Berman I'm sure might think "my work is great and the fans just don't appreciate my brilliance", after all this is a man who doesn't understand why Nemesis failed. But if the correct reasons for the failure of a storyline, and series, are not identified, then improvements can never be made. Rather than expecting the fans to conform to the storylines, the writers have to raise their game and provide material that can hold the interest of the viewers.

Welcome to the boards, Lady Britannia. :dude:

I found the Temporal Cold War idea interesting, but one that shouldn't be dwelled upon. It's a nice little diversion, but not enough to become a major storyline or plot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the welcome. The Temporal Cold War was the warning sign that Rick Berman, possibly under pressure from network influences, had begun to lose faith in the concept of the series, which was supposed to be based on Federation building. The shift to time travel and such was a disaster. Same applies to the Vulcans who were very "un-Vulcanlike" throughout Enterprise, which kind of defeats the purpose of even featuring the Vulcans on the series, which the writers made even worse by depicting Archer as the trigger for the Vulcan philosophical revolution.

 

It comes down to one thing really in my opinion. Rather than pinning the failure of this arc on the supposed "shortsightedness" or the "lack of appreciation" from the fans, it makes more sense to see it as the fans tuning in to see a concept that Rick Berman was either unwilling or unable to execute properly, then tuning out in disappointment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

to me the 3 episodes to the 3rd season were great (cause it took so (I'm trying to misspell a badword but can't) long to end the Xindi mess), then somewhere towards the middle-end of the forth season were great....except you end it with riker and troi witnessing the birth of the federation. i mean why would you slice in parts of the last season of TNG - The Pegasus, skip 7 years of the orginal enterprise's history, then end it like they did? i mean to me it's just stupid. promote archer to admiral, have someone he trusts to take over, show what happens between tpol and trip, and let it be done with it for god sakes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought it was a great story only to be ruined by the Nazi plot at the end of the arc.. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

well of course, but like they did in the 3rd season, the time travel bit was too early of enterprise. probably didn't get better until "in a mirror darkly..."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this