Borg Queen

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

WARNING: THIS THREAD MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS

 

We have seen the Borg Queen 4 times in the Trek franchise.

 

Star Trek: First Contact

Star Trek: Voyager

"Dark Frontier"

"Unimatrix Zero"

"Endgame"

 

In ST:FC, Alice Krige played the Brorg Queen, who died at the end of the movie. Then we see a new Queen played by Susanna Thompson in "Dark Frontier", but her Diamond-shaped ship is destroyed, thus she is killed. However, the next time we see the Queen, in "Unimatrix Zero", she is played by Susanna Thompson. Then we see her one last time in "Endgame" played by Alice Krige.

 

Now, before we go into a Borg Queen discussion, there's something I'd like to access.

 

Do we assume that the Queen allways looks exactly the same, possibly via cloning, and dissmiss the "different Queen" thing as recasting the character, or would it be more logical to assume that there are "different" queens? If we could say there asre subtly different Queens, how come some look alike and some differ?

 

Well, what are your thoughts?

[ARMS 0]

Personally i could not tell the two Queens apart, except when i looked at the credits.

 

I think maybe there are severall back ups queens like in an ant colony, should the queen die one of these drones would become the active queen. I think if this is true then 7 of 9 was one of these, as she was picked to speak for the borg and the queen is obviously very fond of her. I assume that when a drone with the ability to handle the processing demands of queen life is assimilated they become back up queens.

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

That's very interresting! I have 2 theories...

 

1. The Queen is the sole individual in the collective consciencous. When she wants to physically manifestate herself, she has a body assembled and lowers into it. If she dies, her "body" is cloned and ready for assembling in the event she wants to manifest herself in a physical form.

 

2. In the event the Queen dies, a female drone closely resembling her who also has a high position, probably working directly under the Queen, would be "promoted" and joined with the Queen's consciencous. If this were to be true, than it's very likely that Seven may have been a future Borg Queen.

 

I think theory #1 is more likely. What about you guys?

 

Also, the Queen in "Dark Frontier" explained that she herself was assimilated from species 123 or some low number like that, and we learned in "Unimtrix Zero" that she was just a child when assimilated. Do you think she ment the Queen Consciencous, or the Body she was currently inhabbiting?

[ARMS 0]

That's very interresting!  I have 2 theories...

 

1. The Queen is the sole individual in the collective consciencous.  When she wants to physically manifestate herself, she has a body assembled and lowers into it.  If she dies, her "body" is cloned and ready for assembling in the event she wants to manifest herself in a physical form.

 

2. In the event the Queen dies, a female drone closely resembling her who also has a high position, probably working directly under the Queen, would be "promoted" and joined with the Queen's consciencous.  If this were to be true, than it's very likely that Seven may have been a future Borg Queen.

 

I think theory #1 is more likely.  What about you guys?

 

Also, the Queen in "Dark Frontier" explained that she herself was assimilated from species 123 or some low number like that, and we learned in "Unimtrix Zero" that she was just a child when assimilated.  Do you think she ment the Queen Consciencous, or the Body she was currently inhabbiting?

Probably the body she was inhabiting.

 

If you remember she apparently was onboard that ship at Wolf 359

 

You, you were there all along, but that ship, and all the Borg on it were destroyed...

 

You think in such 3 dimensional terms, how small you've become

 

The cloned and assembled body is likely :)

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

Yeah, I think the fact that they went to a LOT of effort to make both Queen's look alike was trying to hide the fact that it was a different actress, thus the cloning thing is what I'm gonna go with.

 

And you're right. It seems the Queen manifests herself on ships that are far, far away from the collective. Like with Wolfr 359 and in ST:FC. :)

 

Oh, here's a picture of her ship!

[44 of 88 0]

I think that each unimatrix is its own hierarchy, comparable to that of a royal family. It has drones, adjuncts, and a queen. In a royal family, the family can not continue without a king/queen. Thusly, when the king/queen dies, the primary adjunct takes the place of the king/queen, and so on. Something to support my theory is the fact that the queen was placed in a tactical diamond. This is a weak ship in the general scheme of things, and her ship was surrounded by the more powerful cubes. This shows that it was too risky to put the queen into battle, so other ships fought for her, similar to the royal families. And yes, I am implying that there are several queens; one designated to each unimatrix.

[jdigs 0]

sorry..when was it discoverd that Seven was next in line for queenship? or is that pure guessing?

[Yillara Skye 1]

sorry..when was it discoverd that Seven was next in line for queenship? or is that pure guessing?

My brother once had said something about that, but when I asked him what episode so I could ask everyone here...he couldn't remember(He isn't a fan of Voyager...just mainly of Seven-He is a Borg fan), so all I can say is my brother said it was mentioned in an episode....

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

I think that each unimatrix is its own hierarchy, comparable to that of a royal family. It has drones, adjuncts, and a queen. In a royal family, the family can not continue without a king/queen. Thusly, when the king/queen dies, the primary adjunct takes the place of the king/queen, and so on. Something to support my theory is the fact that the queen was placed in a tactical diamond. This is a weak ship in the general scheme of things, and her ship was surrounded by the more powerful cubes. This shows that it was too risky to put the queen into battle, so other ships fought for her, similar to the royal families. And yes, I am implying that there are several queens; one designated to each unimatrix.

That's a nice theory, but how does any of that relate to the Borg? Remember in ST:FC? She said, "I am the Borg." I don't see how there would be a need to have more than one Queen as she seems to have control over the entire collective.

 

jdigs,

It's just a theory, that's all. :)

 

Star Trek: First Contact / ST:VOY "Dark Frontier"

ST:VOY "Unimatrix Zero" / ST:VOY "Endgame"

[~Crims~ 0]

I couldn't really tell them apart. I think they were meant to be the same person.

[Takara_Soong 4]

Do you remember what the Borg Queen said to Picard "you think in such 3 dimensional terms". The Borg Queen is a consciensousness that exists in the hive mind. As long as the hive mind exists so does the Queen. Her physical manifestation could be anything but it is the consciensousness that matters.

[Admiral Kirk 1]

I agree with Takara and Cap. The Borg queen seems to be present on the Borg ships even when we can't see her. She probably can exist many places at once and her bodies are just vessels that carry her concienceness. Perhaps at the end of FC when Picard snapped what was left of her spinal cord a signal being transmitted from somewhere (delta quadrant?) was cut off.

[jdigs 0]

I agree with Takara and Cap.  The Borg queen seems to be present on  the Borg ships even when we can't see her.  She probably can exist many places at once and her bodies are just vessels that carry her concienceness.  Perhaps at the end of FC when Picard snapped what was left of her spinal cord a signal being transmitted from somewhere  (delta quadrant?) was cut off.

Yea..That's a good explanation..That was why the Borg were created..To be unbeatable.

[ddillard 2]

I have always thought of the Borg Queen as a manifestation of the collective that is only in physical form when the Borg feel the need to communicate with other species in a manner that is easier for them to understand. Kind of like Locutis was used to communicate with humanity. I do not think that the body is really important, and that the body is simply controlled by the Borg collective in order to make communication easier.

[ARMS 0]

sorry..when was it discoverd that Seven was next in line for queenship? or is that pure guessing?

7 of 9 Tertiary Ajunct of unimatrix 01, the queens unimatrix, seven was obviously gona be next after 2 queens died.

 

I agree completely with 44 of 88

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

I have always thought of the Borg Queen as a manifestation of the collective that is only in physical form when the Borg feel the need to communicate with other species in a manner that is easier for them to understand.  Kind of like Locutis was used to communicate with humanity.  I do not think that the body is really important, and that the body is simply controlled by the Borg collective in order to make communication easier.

I think you're wrong. We've seen times were the Queen says "I am the Borg" or "we", and we've even seen her "give orders" to near by drones or to the collective itself. The way I see it, she is more like the sole individual who's purpose is to keep the Borg Collective Consciencous in order, and as a result, she also has complete control if desired. Remember in "Endgame"? The Borg said they'd assimilate Voyager but the Queen told them to let them go. It's a little confusing.

 

As I see it, she is the Borg. She keeps the collective in order and controls it. She also has complete access to all drones. As she said, "I am the Borg."

 

To everyone else, I've allways assumed she was a seperate entity within the collective. My big question since her appearance on Voyager has been this: Does she have the same body cloned over and over or does she "promote" a similar looking drone to join with her as the new Queen?

[ARMS 0]

I have always thought of the Borg Queen as a manifestation of the collective that is only in physical form when the Borg feel the need to communicate with other species in a manner that is easier for them to understand.  Kind of like Locutis was used to communicate with humanity.  I do not think that the body is really important, and that the body is simply controlled by the Borg collective in order to make communication easier.

I think you're wrong. We've seen times were the Queen says "I am the Borg" or "we", and we've even seen her "give orders" to near by drones or to the collective itself. The way I see it, she is more like the sole individual who's purpose is to keep the Borg Collective Consciencous in order, and as a result, she also has complete control if desired. Remember in "Endgame"? The Borg said they'd assimilate Voyager but the Queen told them to let them go. It's a little confusing.

 

As I see it, she is the Borg. She keeps the collective in order and controls it. She also has complete access to all drones. As she said, "I am the Borg."

 

To everyone else, I've allways assumed she was a seperate entity within the collective. My big question since her appearance on Voyager has been this: Does she have the same body cloned over and over or does she "promote" a similar looking drone to join with her as the new Queen?

Perhaps she's the head queen?

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

I don't think there's more than 1 Queen. I say there's allways 2 Queens. 1 active Queen, and 1 backup Queen incase the current one dies.

[ARMS 0]

I don't think there's more than 1 Queen.  I say there's allways 2 Queens.  1 active Queen, and 1 backup Queen incase the current one dies.

Or perhaps there's one active queen and thousands of inactive queen bodies.

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

I don't think there's more than 1 Queen.  I say there's allways 2 Queens.  1 active Queen, and 1 backup Queen incase the current one dies.

Or perhaps there's one active queen and thousands of inactive queen bodies.

Now there's an idea! I like to think she has "parts" on every ship, structure, and planet... in the event she wants to manifest herself there, all they gotta do is assemble here as she accesses that body. Poof she can be anywhere or multiple places at once!

[ddillard 2]

I have always thought of the Borg Queen as a manifestation of the collective that is only in physical form when the Borg feel the need to communicate with other species in a manner that is easier for them to understand.  Kind of like Locutis was used to communicate with humanity.  I do not think that the body is really important, and that the body is simply controlled by the Borg collective in order to make communication easier.

I think you're wrong. We've seen times were the Queen says "I am the Borg" or "we", and we've even seen her "give orders" to near by drones or to the collective itself. The way I see it, she is more like the sole individual who's purpose is to keep the Borg Collective Consciencous in order, and as a result, she also has complete control if desired. Remember in "Endgame"? The Borg said they'd assimilate Voyager but the Queen told them to let them go. It's a little confusing.

 

As I see it, she is the Borg. She keeps the collective in order and controls it. She also has complete access to all drones. As she said, "I am the Borg."

 

To everyone else, I've allways assumed she was a seperate entity within the collective. My big question since her appearance on Voyager has been this: Does she have the same body cloned over and over or does she "promote" a similar looking drone to join with her as the new Queen?

We will simply have to agree to disagree on this one.

[ARMS 0]

 

Although this was meant as a joke it does raise an intersting point; Q did say the Borg were genderless, but the Queen appears to be female...

[Riaan 0]

Interesting.

 

I have often wondered if there was only one Borg Queen or one for each Borg ship (like a queen bee for each hive).

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

Interesting.

 

I have often wondered if there was only one Borg Queen or one for each Borg ship (like a queen bee for each hive).

Well, if there was a Queen for each ship, that would indicate that each ship is it's own collective. We've learned that each ship has a vinculum, which connects all the minds on a Borg vessel. With this said, I believe there is only one Queen, she can be anywhere, anytime, or be in multiple places at once. :lol:

[TrekkieMage 0]

 

Although this was meant as a joke it does raise an intersting point; Q did say the Borg were genderless, but the Queen appears to be female... :lol:

I guess that since she was female before assimilation, she still maintains the appearance and voice of a female.

[Gotabite 0]

Or perhaps there's one active queen and thousands of inactive queen bodies.

I agree with your assessment, I am from the school of thought that there is only one Borg Queen. :borgqueen: But she has access to many bodies. The fact that she has looked different at times in different series, I've explained away to the fact that two different actresses have played this role. :borgqueen: Also, I wish that I could remember the Voyager episode where it seemed obvious thatthe Borg Queen wanted Seven to have a special role within the collective, but I need to research that. I didn't have the impression that she'd be the next Queen, but that in some way she would be superior to the other drones. :)

This is an interesting discussion, and I hope it will go on for a while.

[A l t e r E g o 9]

[glow=red]I wish that I could remember the Voyager episode where it seemed obvious thatthe Borg Queen wanted Seven to have a special role within the collective, but I need to research that.  I didn't have the impression that she'd be the next Queen, but that in some way she would be superior to the other drones. [/color]

I don't remember the name of that episode but I do remember seeing it and the impression I got for the Queens reason was, that Seven was to be next in line to try to achieve the same thing she had tried to do with Picard. What was it, 'a bridge to humanity' or something like that.

[Gotabite 0]

I don't remember the name of that episode but I do remember seeing it and the impression I got for the Queens reason was, that Seven was to be next in line to try to achieve the same thing she had tried to do with Picard. What was it, 'a bridge to humanity' or something like that.

:borgqueen: Sure wish someone could help us with the episode. :borgqueen:

[Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1]

"Dark Frontier"

[Ezri Dax 0]

For me, the borg queen represente the collective.

 

I mean, if you could see the collective as one, it would be her material representation.

 

So, maybe when the one active dies, another one is born somewhere else, from a drone that is selectionned.

 

 

I agree, this is a fasinating subject to think about...