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thayln

Darker, more dangerous Archer

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Do you like this one? Haunted

 

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Or how about this one? Definitely Dangerous

 

scotthut.jpg

 

This is still probably my favorite: Bloody and pissed as hell

 

Click for Spoiler:

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No lie. It's about time TPTB got rid of the namby pamby writing for Archer and put the character in a situation where he's forced to make morally gray choices. Archer has no United Federation of Planets for support. He's all alone. I think fans might like him better if he's forced to make shocking choices and be all tortured about them. A darker Jonathan Archer carries more weight and presence. I also like the fact that Scott hinted in the last Star Trek publication that he felt that Archer and Tucker's relationship was neglected during most of season two and that the writers may be crafting some conflict for these two men during season three that lasts longer than five minutes. Me like. It will be heartbreaking to watch them fight, but me like. :biggrin:

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OH. Well, I have seen that all Trekkies seem to hate the soft Archer. But I even like him for his prudence (dictionary!) and his courage.

 

I don´t like the idea that he will be such reckless like Kirk always has been.

 

But I LOVE the pics (one is missing)

 

Go on with that!

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Not all Trekkies dislike the "soft Archer".  While I'd like him to get serrious and tough, I don't like the idea of him going "dark" and all.

well i dont like the soft archer. he seems like to much of a nice guy to be a captain, especially of the earths first warp 5 ship. seems odd.

 

i think if he were to get tougher, he would be more believable, and if he were to get darker and have a troubled side to him, it would make his character more interesting. i find him kind of bland right now.

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I too would like to see him serrious and tough'n up.  However, we allready saw a "dark Captain" in the form of DS9's Sisko.  I'd rather have something different.

ya thats true. i think that archer is just too one-sided. he needs to be a bit more complex. maybe something will happen to a crewmember and he'll blame it on himself.

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It all depends on how you define "dark." I don't dislike Archer now. Let me clarify. On a personal level I can understand how the man would have many friends who care about him. He's very appealing in one on one situations with other characters. As far as Archer's professional behavior has been written, I think the writing has been apalling.

 

Taking a dog with you to a planet, the entire race of which has demonstrated itself to be preternaturally easy to offend? Orchestrating a prison break,thus offending a militaristic and brutal government for a group of Suliban whom he cannot be certain are entirely unsympathetic to the Cabal (but assumed they weren't because of a lack of genetic enhancements)? Telling those lies to their captors in "The Communicator" instead of saying nothing so that they think the their enemies have greater technological capabilities than they do. "The Communicator" aptly demonstrated the schizophrenic writing that has characterized Jon Archer. He displays shockingly little wisdom, evidenced by his lies to his captors, yet he's incredibly tender with Malcolm who is obviously upset and frightened.

 

By "darker" I don't mean murderous, wholly uncaring and willing to rape Xindi humanoid women. By darker I mean less trusting of strangers. No more inviting aliens to dinner. By darker I mean less casual with the crew and more adherent to a command structure. I want to see an Archer who snaps at people a little more than before because of the enormous pressure he's under. I want to see an Archer less willing to take T'Pol's advice about taking the peaceful course of action because he believes that the danger Earth now faces justifies a harsher course of action. I want to see an Archer who is struggling with the morally gray notion of the end justifying the means.. Deep down Archer knows better but drastic situations sometimes don't present a perfect, wholly morally correct solution. Archer never saw a war on Earth while he grew up. Humans probably looked down a little bit on their "war like" ancestors of a century past. Now he's confronted with a tangible physical threat to Earth and he may have to be "warlike" whether he wants to accept that or not. Fear does that to a person.

 

I want to see the effects of that psychological struggle on Jonathan. I want to see the stress affect his congenial nature. I want to see him make a questionable choice along the "ends justifies the means" tangent. I want to see him push T'Pol away a bit and reach back for his friend Trip like he did in "Silent Enemy" and "Vox Sola," only to discover that Trip's not as accessible as he once was because of his own grief.

 

I want a captain with "presence." He doesn't have to become an amoral bastard. I just want some presence.

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Yes, presence and complexity. Having to make hard choices and then live with them. They just can't play him as the goofy explorer when the future of Earth is at stake, and this kind of mission has to affect him, powerfully. It wouldn't be realistic.

 

One of the reasons I love this show is because the characters change and grow.

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Thank you for clarifying...I can live with that description. I was a little worried. Dark to me conjures up insanity, pre-occupation with death etc.

 

I think serious is good but I hope they have a couple of breaks - if they totally lose the humor then it will be grim. I am truly afraid there will no more humorous remarks from Trip although I'll be glad to see him less "goofy". Schizophrenic writers...that's a good way to put it. I want more Trip like on the bridge in Cease Fire. And I wouldn't mind an occasional visit to another Lost Civilization (?) type world for Archer.

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Stardate:213567.8

 

 

I like the idea of a "darker more serious" Archer as well.I have always thought it weird that he was so damn nice to everybody.

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Imo, Archer still has time to grow..I think he will finmd his groove and personnaly I like how nice he is, its refreshing..he still gets the job done.

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Yes, presence and complexity.  Having to make hard choices and then live with them.  They just can't play him as the goofy explorer when the future of Earth is at stake, and this kind of mission has to affect him, powerfully.  It wouldn't be realistic.

 

One of the reasons I love this show is because the characters change and grow.

 

I think serious is good but I hope they have a couple of breaks - if they totally lose the humor then it will be grim.  I am truly afraid there will no more humorous remarks from Trip although I'll be glad to see him less "goofy".  Schizophrenic writers...that's a good way to put it.  I want more Trip like on the bridge in Cease Fire.  And I wouldn't mind an occasional visit to another Lost Civilization (?) type world for Archer.

 

I agree with both of you. This will cause both the characters and the show grow.

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Hmm.. Let me crew things a little bit up :P

 

You want him more decisive - stronger - not so casual with the crew? Do you want a new kind of Piccard?

Do you really think "ends justify the means" - Is that STARTREK????? Gene Rodenberry would rotate in his grave!!!!

 

OK, Jon is too trusting to strangers, and Porthos - he is cute no way and I love him, but as to me he don't suit on a star ship.

 

I also like to see characters develop and grow but I wouldn't want that extreme changes. As to me Archer is a perfect new kind of captain, refreshing and reliable.

 

When I first heard about ENT in the Internet, long before it was aired, and saw pictures of the crew (to that ime I had never heard about Scott Bakula before) I was sure I wouldn't like this show. I didn't like the interieur of the ship, I didn't like the uniforms and the actors didn't attract me as well. But when I saw ENT during a convention it took max. 10 minutes and I was facinated !!! Facinated from the atmosphere on the bridge, the way Jon interacted with the crew and the way he dealt with problems and that hasn't changed til now.

 

Therefore let him grow, the new challanges within the Delphic sphere will make him stronger but nooooo extreme changes!!!!!!!!

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I don't mind changes to the character as long as they make sense. If a war is brewing then perhaps everyone will become a bit harder in nature. It will be interesting to see what scars form. I also hope this is an intense conflict with long lasting ramifications that result in the formation of the Federation. :P

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I personally believe that Archer is one of the characters that someone has to grow to like, but he shouldnt be... he is the captain and the star of the show and should be dramatic and have a impact on every trekkie/ non-trekkie out there. This is why Picard, Sisko, and Janeway, and Kirk were great actors, they touched everyone. To the original posting I would not like to see a darker side of Archer, but i would like to see him take more risk and chances as he does with the Andorians.

 

:unsure: Bel Ami ;)

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