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Dark Reality

Star Wars: The "Clerks." Debate

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Has anyone here seen Clerks.? (Yep, the period is part of the title.) Came out in 1994, black-and-white psuedo-documentary about convenience store clerks? Great film, though the language might put you off if you have kids - watch it when they're not around. Also there's some adult dialogue.

 

Anyway, there's a little bit of Star Wars debate going on in one scene. From the script:

 

RANDAL: You know what else I noticed in Jedi?

DANTE: There's more?

RANDAL: So they build another Death Star, right?

DANTE: Yeah.

RANDAL: Now the first one they built was completed and fully operational before the Rebels destroyed it.

DANTE: Luke blew it up. Give credit where it's due.

RANDAL: And the second one was still being built when they blew it up.

DANTE: Compliments of Lando Calrissian.

RANDAL: Something just never sat right with me the second time they destroyed it. I could never put my finger on it-something just wasn't right.

DANTE: And you figured it out?

RANDAL: Well, the thing is, the first Death Star was manned by the Imperial army-storm troopers, dignitaries- the only people onboard were Imperials.

DANTE: Basically.

RANDAL: So when they blew it up, no prob. Evil is punished.

DANTE: And the second time around...?

RANDAL: The second time around, it wasn't even finished yet. They were still under construction.

DANTE: So?

RANDAL: A construction job of that magnitude would require a helluva lot more manpower than the Imperial army had to offer. I'll bet there were independent contractors working on that thing: plumbers, aluminum siders, roofers.

DANTE: Not just Imperials, is what you're getting at.

RANDAL: Exactly. In order to get it built quickly and quietly they'd hire anybody who could do the job. Do you think the average storm trooper knows how to install a toilet main? All they know is killing and white uniforms.

DANTE: All right, so even if independent contractors are working on the Death Star, why are you uneasy with its destruction?

RANDAL: All those innocent contractors hired to do a job were killed-casualties of a war they had nothing to do with. **notices Dante's confusion** All right, look-you're a roofer, and some juicy government contract comes your way; you got the wife and kids and the two-story in suburbia-this is a government contract, which means all sorts of benefits. All of a sudden these left-wing militants blast you with lasers and wipe out everyone within a three-mile radius. You didn't ask for that. You have no personal politics. You're just trying to scrape out a living.

 

Your thoughts? Does Randal have a point? We didn't see any independent contractors on the Death Star, but they had to have been there. Though Vader does threaten a commander, almost implying that the Stormtroopers are actually involved with the construction, he could very well have been commanding Stormtroopers who were in turn commanding groups of independent contractors. You'd think they'd use contractors from one of the many Imperial worlds. Also given, you'd assume that they weren't paying for it, but rather using slave labor of some kind. It's the Empire for crying out loud. They're not nice people. Anyway, a customer interrupts them and has his piece to say.

 

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: Excuse me. I don't mean to interrupt, but what were you talking about?

RANDAL: The ending of Return of the Jedi.

DANTE: My friend is trying to convince me that any contractors working on the uncompleted Death Star were innocent victims when the space station was destroyed by the rebels.

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: Well, I'm a contractor myself. I'm a roofer... **digs into pocket and produces business card** Dunn and Reddy Home Improvements. And speaking as a roofer, I can say that a roofer's personal politics come heavily into play when choosing jobs.

RANDAL: Like when?

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: Three months ago I was offered a job up in the hills. A beautiful house with tons of property. It was a simple reshingling job, but I was told that if it was finished within a day, my price would be doubled. Then I realized whose house it was.

DANTE: Whose house was it?

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: Dominick Bambino's.

RANDAL: "Babyface" Bambino? The gangster?

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: The same. The money was right, but the risk was too big. I knew who he was, and based on that, I passed the job on to a friend of mine.

DANTE: Based on personal politics.

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: Right. And that week, the Foresci family put a hit on Babyface's house. My friend was shot and killed. He wasn't even finished shingling.

RANDAL: No way!

BLUE-COLLAR MAN: I'm alive because I knew there were risks involved taking on that particular client. My friend wasn't so lucky. You know, any contractor willing to work on that Death Star knew the risks. If they were killed, it was their own fault. A roofer listens to this... **taps his heart** not his wallet.

**The BLUE-COLLAR MAN exits. DANTE and RANDAL remain respectfully quiet for a moment.**

 

He's got a point, but the point the film never makes is, why would the roofer pass the job on to his friend without warning him? I think whether he did or not would say how much of a friend he was. But he does make a good point.

 

More Dante and Randal on Star Wars (this is immediately before their little debate; actually BLUE-COLLAR MAN walks in right after the following, right before the first bit of script):

 

RANDAL: Which did you like better: Jedi or The Empire Strikes Back?

DANTE: (exasperated) Empire.

RANDAL: Blasphemy.

DANTE: Empire had the better ending: Luke gets his hand cut off, and finds out Vader's his father; Han gets frozen and taken away by Boba Fett. It ends on such a down note. And that's life-a series of down endings. All Jedi had was a bunch of Muppets.

RANDAL: There was something else going on in Jedi. I never noticed it until today.

DANTE: What's that?

RANDAL: All right, Vader's boss...

DANTE: The Emperor.

RANDAL: Right, the Emperor. Now the Emperor is kind of a spiritual figure, yes?

DANTE: How do you mean?

RANDAL: Well, he's like the pope for the dark side of the Force. He's a holy man; a shaman, kind of, albeit an evil one.

DANTE: I guess.

RANDAL: Now, he's in charge of the Empire. The Imperial government is under his control. And the entire galaxy is under Imperial rule.

DANTE: Yeah.

RANDAL: Then wouldn't that logically mean that it's a theocracy? If the head of the Empire is a priest of some sort, then it stands to reason that the government is therefore one based on religion.

DANTE: It would stand to reason, yes.

RANDAL: Hence, the Empire was a fascist theocracy, and the rebel forces were therefore battling religious persecution.

DANTE: More or less.

RANDAL: The only problem is that at no point in the series did I ever hear Leia or any of the rebels declare a particular religious belief.

DANTE: I think they were Catholics.

 

It should be noted that Kevin Smith, director of Clerks., has said that Empire is his favorite movie. He says Sith is darker, and is often misquoted as saying Sith is his favorite, but I believe he still prefers Empire. Which is funny, because Smith himself was originally going to play Randal (hence, Randal having some of the best lines). And Kevin Smith is Catholic, and just about all of his characters are or can be assumed to be Catholics or "recovering Catholics". In fact his later film "Dogma" is a parody of sorts, of Catholocism. Being a Kevin Smith fan, I recommend all of his films (Clerks., Mallrats, Chasing Amy, Dogma, Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back, Jersey Girl, and the upcoming Clerks. 2.) Chasing Amy has a Star Wars reference, but it's not a nice one. It's meant in jest... but for those of you interested, just google its script and do a search on Luke Skywalker and/or Lando Calrissian. (It's one character's take on the original Star Wars, with a Lando mention.) And there's a parody Star Wars battle in Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back referencing the fight between Vader and Luke at the end of Empire, with a parody mention of Darth Maul.

 

[source: clerks. script]

Edited by Dark Reality

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The Rebels were terrorists, what more would you expect? Anyone who was affiliated with the Empire was their enemy. It's all too true that they would kill anyone and everyone standing in their way....... They kiss their sisters too.

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Hey, I've always thought the Jedi we're every bit as "bad" as the Sith (see my posts at starwarsfans.net :yahoo: ).

 

Obi Wan and Yoda tried to trick Luke into killing his father. Then when Vader blew the scam by spilling the beans on Luke's parentage, they were all "UH,...oh no, this is unfortunate.....you see, we didn't lie exactly,uh...what we said was true.....er, from a certain point of view."

 

:P

 

And nobody can tell me Qwi Gon Jinn could not have also left tattooine with Shmi Skywalker. But he didn't want Anakin to have any greater influces than himself.

Years later, Obi Wan knew Shmi was in trouble (or at least that something very bad was going down on Tattooine, based on his padawan's nightmares), and he refused to let Anakin check it out, or even to tell Anakin that his dreams could mean something significant about his mother. He let Shmi die. Without remorse.

 

The Jedi are lying, word-twisting, self-righteous, insufferable sister kissers.

The Sith are evil, world destroying, self-righteous, power hungry wife chokers.

 

They both suck.

 

My dislike of the Jedi does not mean I dislike the Rebellion, however. The Rebels were cool. Especially Lando and Han.

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But the Dark Side certainly doesn't suck. Dark Side is the awesomest. The Sith just use it for... politics *gag* and choking their wives, of course.

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Hey, I've always thought the Jedi we're every bit as "bad" as the Sith (see my posts at starwarsfans.net :yahoo: ).

 

Obi Wan and Yoda tried to trick Luke into killing his father. Then when Vader blew the scam by spilling the beans on Luke's parentage, they were all "UH,...oh no, this is unfortunate.....you see, we didn't lie exactly,uh...what we said was true.....er, from a certain point of view."

 

:P

 

And nobody can tell me Qwi Gon Jinn could not have also left tattooine with Shmi Skywalker. But he didn't want Anakin to have any greater influces than himself.

Years later, Obi Wan knew Shmi was in trouble (or at least that something very bad was going down on Tattooine, based on his padawan's nightmares), and he refused to let Anakin check it out, or even to tell Anakin that his dreams could mean something significant about his mother. He let Shmi die. Without remorse.

 

The Jedi are lying, word-twisting, self-righteous, insufferable sister kissers.

The Sith are evil, world destroying, self-righteous, power hungry wife chokers.

 

They both suck.

 

My dislike of the Jedi does not mean I dislike the Rebellion, however. The Rebels were cool. Especially Lando and Han.

 

The Jedi had a code where they could not have contact with their families. Attachment in the old republic jedi was forbidden because they were afraid that the feelings for them would make them turn to the darkside. But that would eventually change. Once Luke started the New Republic Jedi, he allowed the Jedi to be married and have families so that they wouldn't have trama over it like his father did over Padme. Even Luke is married.

 

I disagree that the Jedi and Sith are the same. The Sith are very evil compared to the Jedi, they destroy planets and kill innocent people and think nothing of it. True, some aspects of the Old Republic Jedi were a little iffy, but I'd never compare them to the Sith. Qui-Gon tried to get Shmi out from Watto's slavery, but Watto wouldn't have it so between the two he took Anakin. One reason being is that he was "the chosen one" and it was his destiny to leave and another being that he was younger and didn't deserve to spend his childhood and the rest of his life as a slave.

 

Look at Luke, he has had nothing but good intentions and has kept them in the novels. He fights to protect those he loves

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