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Dark Reality

Gonna start watching DS9 all the way through

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I've been watching episodes of DS9 "intermitently" :( that are being aired on Spike TV. I will add my thoughts to this thread on certain episodes here or in another thread. I am beginning to understand why some favor this series over the other ST series, VBG ^^^^ being one. I especially like episode with Vic on the holodeck, giving pointers to Odo on how to woo Major Kira. The kissing scene in the promenade was nice, too. :laugh:

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"Take Me Out to the Holosuite" was a fun episode.  Didn't really have much to do with any of the arcs, just a fun episode to watch.  A Vulcan crew challenges Sisko and his command crew to a game of baseball.  Classic Worf line: "Death to the opposition".  And the first time (only time?) the term Niners is used in the series.  It should have been used sooner methinks... :(  Worth watching when it comes on TV?  For sure.

 

This was a fun episode for sure, another classic Worf quote from this episode was when Nog had to go into the dougout searching for the Vulcan that didn't tag home and didn't know which one to tag. He asked what he should do and Worf yelled "Find him and kill him!" lol You have to love Worf!

 

"Chrysalis" was OK.  I suppose liking this episode carries the requisite of liking the four genetically enhanced misfits from "Statistical Probabilities" (6x09).  They return to DS9 and Bashir makes Serena, the quiet one, able to function in society... then falls in love with her.  Serena makes a good prediction regarding Ezri: "Once she learns she's more than the sum of her parts, she'll really be someone."  Good generic advice, but it really fits for a joined Trill.  It was good to see Bashir find a woman, but other than that, it fell short of being a good episode.  Worth watching when it comes on TV?  Only if you like the four misfits and/or you really like Bashir.  Other than that it's skippable.

 

This one goes well with the other "mutant" or "Misfits" episode, they throw in some good dominion stuff and in the end all is well on the station. I loved it when Weyoun and Damar were in the cargo bay when Odo came in and they acted like they were lost or something lol This wasn't an episode that you'd miss any key details if you didn't see it but it was still a good episode never the less.

 

 

"Treachery, Faith and the Great River" was a little better.  O'Brien needs a part in less time than the Captain is allowing him, so he gives Nog his access codes and has the Ferengi officer trade, trade, trade, and trade some more to get what they need.  Meanwhile Weyoun 6 defects to Odo, and Weyoun 7 sends some JH after them.  We learn that Weyoun 5 died under mysterious circumstances, and that the Founders are (possibly) dying.  Worth watching if if comes on TV?  Sure, it was entertaining enough.  The episode highlights Odo, Weyoun, and Nog.

 

This episode is always included when I do a Nog-a-thon (that's when I watch several episodes out of order that relate only to Nog, I also do Quark-a-thons and o'Brien-a-thons and so on...) I just love how it all comes together in the end, and with this episode which is the "A" story and which is the "B" story? I think both are "A" quality. The parts with Odo and Weyoun were good and give some good info for the arc and we see a little more into the "mind" of Weyoun.. Weyoun 6 anyway.

 

Good episode, and one that I'd say is a "must see" due to the Dominion info that you get from Weyoun.

 

"Once More Unto the Breach" was a good Klingon episode.  Oh, how I love the Klingon episodes. :laugh: Martok and and old rival, Kor, with Worf, take five Birds of Prey behind enemy lines to strike a blow against the Dominion.  Notice in the beginning, the bottle of Bloodwine Worf shares with Kor is the same year (perhaps the same bottle) he got from Martok at the end of the last episode, 2309.  Nice little bit of continuity if you ask me.  Quark gives Ezri some free advice, but I'm not so sure she will take it.  Worth watching on TV?  Oh yeah, especially if you, too, like the Klingon episodes and any of Kor, Martok, or Worf.

 

I just watched this one on Spike the other day, I really liked this episode and the way Kor went out... though we don't know "for sure" that he died in the battle. I like the way they keep it off screen and leave it to the viewers imagination to fill in the blanks of the glorious battle and honorable death that Kor faced.

 

"The Siege of AR-558" was a good episode about the glory and sacrifice of the Dominion war.  Sisko and the Defiant crew (including Bashir, Ezri, Nog, and Quark) join a diminished crew holding a captured Dominion communications array on a planet, against stiff odds.  This is the second time I've seen someone sharpening a blade with a laser, though I cannot recall the first time.  Should you watch it when it comes on TV?  You shouldn't miss it if you like action.  There are a lot of better episodes, but I can't think of any points to mark against this one.

 

Another "Nog-A-Thon" episode along with "It's Only a Paper Moon". This episode kind of hits home for me personally, though not due to being in battle. A lot of the sequences of them manning their positions with their weapons drawn and watching for the enemy reminded me so much of nights that I did the exact same thing in the Army, though when I did it it was only in training. When I watch this episode I can almost feel the dampness of the ground and feel the cool night air in my lungs as I sit in my foxhole. Anyway, as for the episode I thought it was a great dramatic episode that shows the harsher side of war. It's not all starships, there are ground troops also.

 

An interesting side note to this episode is that "Engineer Kellin" was played by Bill Mumy the actor that played "Will Robinson" in the show "Lost In Space" from 1965-1968.

 

 

"Covenant" was pretty cool.  Dukat starts a cult based on the Pa-wraiths (enemy of the Prophets) and has about 50 Bajorans with him on Empok Nor.  They kidnap Kira, who exposes Dukat as a fraud.  Kind of like something which happened on our world years ago involving poisoned Kool-Aid.  So it was a cool episode, but seemed kind of like filler.  But is it worth watching?  I think so.  Just one thing continues to puzzle me... why don't they ever straighten out Empok Nor, or is it supposed to tilt at an angle?

This one never really set well with me. It was interesting and I've re-watched it several times but it is one that I often skip when I'm going through season 7.

 

"It's Only a Paper Moon" chronicles Nog's emotional recovery following the events of "The Siege of AR-558" with the assistance of Vic Fontaine.  Downplayed is the event that Jake Sisko gets a girlfriend.  A decent episode, a good follow-up to its predecessor, but if you missed that one, you may as well skip this one.  But if you saw the other, it really doesn't matter if you catch this one or not.  Watch it if you like Nog and/or Vic.  I think, should a movie ever follow up DS9 and Voyager, Voyager's Holodoc ought to meet Vic.

 

As I said earlier, I love this episode when combined with "AR-558" but I always enjoy Vic episodes. I only wish they had introduced him earlier then the end of season 6.

 

"Prodigal Daughter" was mostly about Ezri going back to her family for a visit, and to locate O'Brien, who is tracking down the widow of a man he met in "Honor Among Thieves" (6x15).  Turns out Ezri's family business is involved with the Orion Syndicate.  I didn't care for this one all that much... maybe it's because I don't (yet?) care for Ezri that much... because no one else in her family was all that likeable... it just seemed flat.  Worth watching on TV?  Maybe if nothing else is on, or you really want to see all 176 episodes as I do.  Other than that, it's skippable.

 

I liked this episode because it gave more back story on Ezri. Being such a new character we knew very little about her so it helped build her character, plus this is a good companion episode to "Honor Among Thieves". That's something that I think DS9 was very good at doing, taking an earlier episode and making a companion episode to it.

 

As far as the major plot of DS9 goes, I agree it is skippable but if you skip it you lose a chunck of character development for Ezri.

 

"The Emperor's New Cloak" is another alternate universe episode, featuring a mirror Ezri, mirror Leeta, mirror Brunt, and a mirror Vic.  Though they never explain how they get him out of the Holosuite; it doesn't make sense for there to be a real Vic in the AU.  Rom and Quark have to go to the AU to rescue the Nagus (Zek) from the Alliance.  It's a pretty good episode, barring a couple minor faults.  Worth watching?  I think so.  The AU is always fun.

 

I agree, this one is a fun one to watch and you have to ignore a couple of plot holes to enjoy it fully. The major plot hole is the theme of the episode. They're not supposed to have cloaking technology in the AU but in the second or third AU episode the Alliance ships un-cloak right in front of Sisko so someone in the AU does have the technology.

 

 

"Field of Fire" was good.  A serial killer is loose on DS9 and Ezri, with the help of that host she had before Curzon who killed, is determined to track him down.  We never learn exactly why the killer killed those people (aside from whats-his-name's speculative explanation) but it was a good episode nonetheless.  Worth watching?  Sure, it was fun.  You won't miss anything if you miss it, as far as the arcs go, but it was entertaining.

 

Another episode building Ezri's character but this is one that I often skip.

 

Now here's the deal: tomorrow I start work, and I have 12 DS9 episodes left to finish.  I know I can watch 11 in a day; I did that yesterday, as you can see.  So what I'm going to do is watch all of them up to "What You Leave Behind" (series finale, a 2 parter) and then watch that when I get home from work.  I'd only be able to watch half before my girlfriend gets home, and she shouldn't be seeing the last episode.

 

The adventure begins... and, as always, I'll be chronicling my progress in Editpad. :lol:

 

TTFN

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I'll be curious to see your final thoughts on the last few episodes.

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Profit and Lace was on Spike today. Now, Ferengi humour episodes are usually pretty good but this was just bad, some good moments but just overall terrible. Hard to believe it airs right after Valiant which is great (although I cannot stand most of Red Squad) and within 5 episodes of In The Pale Moonlight and Inquisition. The DS9 writers are great but this episode shows they are definitely not infallible.

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Profit and Lace was on Spike today. Now, Ferengi humour episodes are usually pretty good but this was just bad, some good moments but just overall terrible. Hard to believe it airs right after Valiant which is great (although I cannot stand most of Red Squad) and within 5 episodes of In The Pale Moonlight and Inquisition. The DS9 writers are great but this episode shows they are definitely not infallible.

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It's not a favorite of mine, but it has it's moments. Valiant on the other hand has never been a favorite of mine, it's one I usually skip.

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Before I forget... Would I be too obsessed with DS9 to say the [bajoran] Prophets have blessed my cross-country journey, or would that make me sound like Kai Winn (fake)? Nah... get this... I was surprised, in the episode "Badda-Bing Badda-Bang" when Kasidy Yates asked the security guard if he came from Asheville, NC. On the way into NC, Asheville was the first major town, maybe the first town, I came through coming into this state. For those who don't know my state's geography (I'm still learning it myself), Asheville is to the northwest part of the state, in the mountains, near the Tennessee border. It's several hours away from where I actually stopped, but I feel somewhat honored that a character on DS9 made a reference to a point I passed through on my trip. Reading into it further, before I left California, I worked as a security guard, though never in a casino or anything remotely similar. Maybe I'm reaching, maybe it's just a minor point, but I thought it was worth noting, and I forgot to mention it when talking about that episode.

 

Now I have just 2 episodes to go (3 if you count the last as two) and plenty of time to watch them in. w00t!

 

Spoilers ahead!

 

"The Dogs of War", DS9's semi-finale, was OK. The last few episodes have seemed shorter and shorter. Damar's resistance cells are destroyed, but with Kira's help, he starts an uprising in the streets of Cardassia, Braveheart style. Odo's pissed that Starfleet in fact gave him and the Founders the disease, but gives Sisko his word he won't pursue it. DS9 gets a new ship, the third Defiant-class ship (that is the name of the class, right?), the Sao Paul. It's suggested renaming it to Defiant... but wouldn't that make it the Defiant-A or the Defiant-B, like what happened with the Enterprise? Anyway, also Kasidy is pregnant, and by extension we learn that birth control is practiced in the 24th century. Both Sisko and Kasidy were getting injections from Bashir, but one of them skipped a month. One might think that with fundamentalist groups today fighting abortion and even contraceptives (the more extremists believe condoms and The Pill interfere with God's will) and with the Federation's conservative views on life... I'm surprised they don't force couples who [choose to engage in sexual activity] to carry pregnancies to term, then beam the baby out and put it up for adoption, if they don't want it. Because there are people in our society who would consider that their utopian view of childbirth versus those who would choose to remain childless, and the Federation is the ultimate utopia...

 

Now onto the finale. I feel like a Cardassian about to look into one of the Orbs. Mwa ha ha ha ha. OK...

 

"What You Leave Behind" was indeed an awesome finale, and pretty much wraps up everything except one: we still don't know what the Breen look like under those helmets. My guess is they're all Princess Leia clones, but I suppose we'll never know. Posting anything that happens would be a major spoiler, so I'll just say that I was very satisfied with the last episodes and the series as a whole, and if I didn't make it clear before, Deep Space Nine is easily the best Star Trek series, in my opinion. I'll still respect TOS and TNG as groundbreaking predecessors and Voayger and Enterprise as interesting ventures into the Star Trek universe (though I haven't seen all of TOS or ENT), but DS9 is by far my favorite. No competition. Easily the best season finale, easily the best first episode, and more great episodes than any series. My two favorite episodes are still "The Inner Light" (TNG) and "Blink of an Eye" (Voyager), but "What You Leave Behind" is very close. Very close.

 

I'm not done with this thread... I suppose conversation will contine on for a few days at least. I'm down as long as you guys are. And I plan to make a DS9 post on other forums I post on (mine and a couple others) singing the praises of DS9, covering a broader view of each character and what makes DS9 so great. I'll copy that here, of course.

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Spoilers ahead!

DS9 gets a new ship, the third Defiant-class ship (that is the name of the class, right?), the Sao Paul.  It's suggested renaming it to Defiant... but wouldn't that make it the Defiant-A or the Defiant-B, like what happened with the Enterprise? 

 

No, the first (actually second U.S.S. Defiant) was registry number NX-74205 because it was an experimental prototype. The U.S.S. Sao Paulo was registry number NCC-75633 because it is a full production class now, but as a favor to Sisko he was given permission to rename and re-number the Sao Paulo to Defiant and also use Defiant's registry number. So while it has the same name and registry it's not "officially" in the Defiant's "family tree" in any way other then the fact that they are the same class ship.

 

The first U.S.S. Defiant was in TOS and was a Constitution class (the same as the TOS Enterprise) and was lost in Tholian space. We later find out in Enterprise that it was pulled into the Alternate Universe.

 

 

Now onto the finale.  I feel like a Cardassian about to look into one of the Orbs.  Mwa ha ha ha ha.  OK...

 

"What You Leave Behind" was indeed an awesome finale, and pretty much wraps up everything except one: we still don't know what the Breen look like under those helmets.  My guess is they're all Princess Leia clones, but I suppose we'll never know.  Posting anything that happens would be a major spoiler, so I'll just say that I was very satisfied with the last episodes and the series as a whole, and if I didn't make it clear before, Deep Space Nine is easily the best Star Trek series, in my opinion.  I'll still respect TOS and TNG as groundbreaking predecessors and Voayger and Enterprise as interesting ventures into the Star Trek universe (though I haven't seen all of TOS or ENT), but DS9 is by far my favorite.  No competition.  Easily the best season finale, easily the best first episode, and more great episodes than any series.  My two favorite episodes are still "The Inner Light" (TNG) and "Blink of an Eye" (Voyager), but "What You Leave Behind" is very close.  Very close.

 

I'm not done with this thread... I suppose conversation will contine on for a few days at least.  I'm down as long as you guys are.  And I plan to make a DS9 post on other forums I post on (mine and a couple others) singing the praises of DS9, covering a broader view of each character and what makes DS9 so great.  I'll copy that here, of course.

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You've come a long way since this...

 

Click For Spoiler

 

But I was confident that you'd reach this side of "The Great Material Continuum" safe and sound as a tried and true Niner.

 

So everyone, let's break open some Bloodwine! I have a case of the 2309 that has been waiting for just the right occasion!

 

Who's next to take the great "DS9 Challenge"?

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I love everything about DS9 except one thing and its nots with the Series but on the TNG Movies, they could of one time had something to do with DS9, thats why I think it loses some respect with some trekies, but by far my Fav. Series anymore

 

I got the Series lined up by season on my Netflix Quaere to watch season 1-7 without all the Spike TV crap, this thread has inspired me to do that

Edited by dragonwrangler95

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I am beginning to understand why some favor this series over the other ST series,  VBG ^^^^ being one.  I especially like episode with Vic on the holodeck, giving pointers to Odo on how to woo Major Kira.  The kissing scene in the promenade was nice, too.  :(

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I honestly believe that if all Trek fans would watch the entire series start to finnish that a large majority of them would become Niners. That's not to say that the other series aren't good, but DS9 is just a different kind of Trek.

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Ok, I'm giving DS9 a try. B) B)

 

Today I'm watching "Image In The Sand"

 

 

This Romulan who's come to live on the station, she's setting them up, isn't she?

 

This hospital she wants on the unhabited moon is going to be something much worse. B)

 

Am I right?

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It's a good episode but why are you starting with season seven? True it may be, in my opinion, the best season but I'd still recommend you start with season one.

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Because I"m working from home today, and I like the television on in the background, and so, I started at whatever SPIKE was showing today!! B)

 

So what's happened to the son Whorf had on TNG? B)

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MB - Alexander

 

Click For Spoiler

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I'd really suggest watching from Episode 1 on, starting with season 7 will really confuse you.

 

"Image In The Sand" was a good episode but there's so much that happened from season 1 through season 6 that led up to that point. it's like starting a book by reading the last chapter first.

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That's great, DR! B) You've experienced the full greatness of Deep Space Nine the way it was meant to. So tell me, now that you've completed the entire series, who's the better Dax: Jadzia or Ezri? We're counting everything here now! B)

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Jadzia would have to win in a competition with Ezri, but I don't believe people give Ezri a fair shake. We just didn't have enough time to get to know her very well.

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I'd really suggest watching from Episode 1 on, starting with season 7 will really confuse you.

 

"Image In The Sand" was a good episode but there's so much that happened from season 1 through season 6 that led up to that point. it's like starting a book by reading the last chapter first.

 

 

Well as I'm not going to go out and buy them, I'm stuck with Spike's schedule of the show when I am home and not working.

 

I'll tune in today to see where it's going, but I'm working the rest of the week during the times it is broadcast. :dude:

 

Once I invest in TIVO or something, then I'll start copying them daily, so that I can watch it in order.

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MB - That's why you get Cable internet and a little program called BitTorrent... and a fairly big hard drive. Watching downloaded DVD rips has advantages over every other format, so far as I can tell. Against TV, it's obvious: I don't have to put up with commercials, I can pause on demand, I can skip the intro/credits, much better quality, and no station watermarking. Versus DVD, well, all the episodes are on a hard drive... no disc switching. No disc scratching either. Also the official DVDs pack a whopping three or four episodes per disc to keep costs high. Newsflash, a 4.7GB DVD+R disc will hold 11 episodes, I think... it's somewhere in the 10-13 range. Anyway, even with the extras, you only need 15 DVD+R discs, not the 40+ that come with the official pack, to back-up an entire Trek series.

 

Cable or DSL internet + BitTorrent + a big hard drive + a 50-pack of DVD+R discs = Trek Bliss

 

 

I actually stand by my old posts about DS9. It's not a show you watch from the middle. They really did a good job with it, but you have to watch most episodes, and you really have to watch it in order. There aren't a lot of great stories out there that go on so long as Deep Space Nine, because they're ultimately lost on the general public. Most people don't have the time to invest in such a long journey, and the television networks don't respect that at all, so they just play them from wherever. There's another franchise which delivers such developed and intricate stories... it's called Final Fantasy. Anyone who's gone through a FF game knows what I'm talking about. And with FF, there's no coming into the middle and only seeing a part. You have to start from the beginning and take it all the way... or quit partway through, because they're video games. I can't speak for any but VII (7), but VII took me 3-4 months to play through, cheating: I had my characters all maxed out, random battles turned off, and I was following a walkthrough... and it STILL took that long. And when I was done, though I had cheated, I really enjoyed the ending and the complete experience. It's similarly possible to cut fluff from Deep Space Nine and watch only episodes that contribute to the main arc and the arcs involving the characters you love, and still get most out of it, but unlike FF, the fluff is pretty cool, too (random battles, character building = FF fluff).

 

Actually, I thought DS9 had sort of a Final Fantasy finish... not to spoil anything, but with the final events involving Dukat, Winn, Sisko, and the Prophets... just f***'in wow... and that whole sense of fulfillment and completion is exactly what Final Fantasy is all about.

 

Taking that further, I've actually thought about how DS9 would work as sort of a Final Fantasy game. To start as Sisko (who else?) and role-play building relations between Bajor and Cardassia, running the various quests in the Alpha and Gamma quadrants (FF games often had one hero, but many playable characters... and DS9 has about the right amount of main characters) building the various characters... Maybe not all episodes could transition properly, but it might work as a combination strategy/RPG game.

 

Yes, DS9 is a different kind of Trek. With TNG and Voyager, the story really boils down to exploration. That's all TNG is, and little more. Voyager has the arc of getting home, but Janeway tosses chances to get home faster in order to explore a nebula or save an alien race in every other episode... so it's more about exploring the Delta Quadrant than getting back to the Alpha Quadrant. I don't know much about Enterprise, but I doubt it's not as much about exploration as the others. DS9, on the other hand, turns within to explore each character and what's happening in one place. Between the Cardassian-Bajoran conflict wrap-up and the discovery of the Wormhole/Celestial Temple and the wonders within, there was more for the crew to explore by staying on a stationary space station than flying around in a starship.

 

 

@TR: Of course I prefer Jadzia out of the two. How could I not? But Ezri only had one season, and that's not fair. Also, she didn't exactly get off to a great start... between the whiny stuff and her whole family being involved with the Orion Syndicate... No, she should have had a few episodes. Either they should have run DS9 10-11 seasons (they could have, easily) or they should have just let Jadzia live. Killing her really only served to get Sisko and Jake away from the station for a while.

 

Actually my favorite Dax would have to be Curzon, though we only hear of him. I think they should have had a few more Curzon episodes, either with flashbacks or with some other way to bring him back. They could have done this in the mirror universe... why oh why does Dax changing hosts in the regular universe force it to happen as well in the mirror universe? I know it doesn't, that it just happens that way, but a great twist would have been for Sisko to meet Curzon Dax in the mirror universe, but with different hosts before Curzon, so it's Curzon, but with different memories, and thus, a different persona... and then go from Mirror Curzon to Mirror Jadzia, and then you'd have an excuse to make Mirror Jadzia evil, or however they want her.

 

 

Rather than jump into a report on DS9, I wanted to get more insight into the series, really delve deeper into it, so I'm going to watch all of the extras as well. The Torrents I downloaded came with, not only all 176 episodes, but a dozen or so "extras" per season. Most notably, crew dossiers for every major character except Ezri... Keiko and Molly don't have one, Morn, Rom, and Nog don't have them... Dukat, Damar, Kai Winn, Shakar don't have them... but just about every other main character has one. Then there are highlights, for example a closer look at "Trials and Tribble-ations" and another called "24th Century Wedding", which I can only assume is about Worf's wedding to Jadzia Dax in "You Are Cordially Invited...". Then there are these odd files, "Section 31 Hidden File XY". I've looked at a few, and they're little featurettes, but they're just not labelled for what they are.

 

First I'm watching the dossiers, in the order they're given. The first one is Nana Visitor/Kira Nerys. There's only one shot of Nana completely out of makeup, with blonde hair, and I'd have never recognized her if not for her voice. She looks much better as a brunette, but that's just how I know her, from the show. Then there's Terry Farrell/Jadzia Dax. Terrry doesn't look much like Jadzia out of makeup, except maybe for the eyes. Her hair is shorter, fuller... she reminds me of a friend of mine I met online (who actually got to meet my girlfriend in person before I did, she travels a lot). And I am SO glad Michael Westmore dropped the forehead effect for the spots. Dax has always been about the spots, no real two ways about it. Then there's Rene Auberjonois/Odo, who I'd never recognize out of makeup, even if he spoke. I could tell the guy behind Odo was an older man, but I didn't think he was that old. Rene is a really distinguished character, and with a full beard and moustache to boot, so he really had to go a long way to become Odo. Next up was Michael Dorn/Worf. I had an idea of what Dorn was like, because of "Far Beyond the Stars" where he appeared out of makeup (Rene was in the same episode, but still in makeup, just not in costume), but also because I knew he was the bus driver in "Speed" (Keanu Reeves, Sandra Bullock, came out between or around TNG and DS9). It's not just the forehead that makes Worf; Dorn has a very subtle voice, and when playing Worf, he speaks up. The closest Dorn gets to his usual voice is when he speaks low (for example, in "First Contact" when he says to Picard "If you were any other man, I would kill you where you stand"). Colm (pronounced just like "Calm" or "Column", depending on who's saying it... I thought it was pronounced like the 'colm' in 'Malcolm', if you can see the difference) Meaney looks EXACTLY like Miles O'Brien; all he really did, it seems, is throw on the uniform. But then, they (Meaney, Behr) make the point that O'Brien is the most human character, the "every man" character.

 

Then we have Alexander Siddig/Bashir. Mirror Bashir looks more like Siddig in real life, with the stubble. In fact, with that look, he could have played a pirate of sorts, maybe on Voyager... that would have been interesting. I agree with what Siddig said at the end of the featurette as being seen as a 'white' actor... I knew he was Middle Eastern, but I could never really think of him as such. (Not that being Middle Eastern is a bad thing... but then Bashir has very light skin anyway, so it's hard to distinguish, even if you know he's not 'white'.) I had no idea he had a cameo appearance on TNG; had I not watched this featurette, I would have jumped out of my seat seeing Bashir on the Enterprise-D. I thought I had all my crossovers down. We also see Andrew Robinson/Garak in this featurette... Being a Cardassian, he looks nothing like his character, but the voice is similar... it lacks the intrigue of Garak's whole persona, but it's him. I accidentally skipped Quark (overlooked it) and intentionally skipped Ben Sisko, because I really felt his would be the most important featurette among the crew dossiers. Cirroc Lofton looks just like Jake, and it's really interesting to see within 10 minutes how much he ages from the first to the last episodes. Also we see Aaron Eisenberg, aka Nog, who looks nothing like his character (but then, the Ferengi makeup is a full mask... even around the cheeks it's puffier, changed... The voice is the same, though. Quark/Armin Shimmerman's file actually had a few other people: Max Grodenchik as Rom and Jeffery Combs as Brunt (also as Weyoun, but that's not brought up). None of the Ferengi look anything like their actors, but only Armin sounded like Quark. Both Max and Jeffery altered their voices for their characters (Rom and Brunt). And though I didn't recognize Armin in the TNG episode "The Last Outpost", I agree that Quark really changed the whole outlook on Ferengi. With Avery Brooks/Sisko's file, we don't see Dukat or Winn, as I hoped, but we do see Penny Johnson (Kasidy Yates). Both of them look just like their characters, of course.

 

I wasn't expecting to learn a whole lot from just the crew dossiers, but the highlights and recaps were good to see. I learned a couple things... most notably Bashir's cameo appearance on TNG. And, to a lesser extent, Quark's (though that Ferengi probably wasn't "Quark"). I knew Ethan Phillips (Neelix, on Voyager) played a Ferengi in the TNG episode "Menage a Troi", but thought that was the only later-series character to appear on TNG, albeit as another character. Now I wouldn't be surprised if some of the DS9 and Voyager people played extras or small parts on TNG. I know Tim Russ (Tuvok) and Robert Picardo (The Doctor) from Voyager both had cameos on DS9 but that's different.

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Rather than jump into a report on DS9, I wanted to get more insight into the series, really delve deeper into it, so I'm going to watch all of the extras as well. The Torrents I downloaded came with, not only all 176 episodes, but a dozen or so "extras" per season. Most notably, crew dossiers for every major character except Ezri... Keiko and Molly don't have one, Morn, Rom, and Nog don't have them... Dukat, Damar, Kai Winn, Shakar don't have them... but just about every other main character has one. Then there are highlights, for example a closer look at "Trials and Tribble-ations" and another called "24th Century Wedding", which I can only assume is about Worf's wedding to Jadzia Dax in "You Are Cordially Invited...". Then there are these odd files, "Section 31 Hidden File XY". I've looked at a few, and they're little featurettes, but they're just not labelled for what they are.

 

I was just watching the special features of season 6 last night, I enjoy watching them and watching the interviews of the actors. There is another disc of extra's out there that was only sold with sets at Best Buy though, it contains the dossier for Ezri and even has a featurette on Morn called "Morn Speaks". I've meant to try to get ahold of that disc but just haven't taken the time to search for it.

 

I agree with what Siddig said at the end of the featurette as being seen as a 'white' actor... I knew he was Middle Eastern, but I could never really think of him as such. (Not that being Middle Eastern is a bad thing... but then Bashir has very light skin anyway, so it's hard to distinguish, even if you know he's not 'white'.)

 

I think that's one thing about a lot of Star Trek fans that you may not find in a random sample of the general public. Trek fans (for the most part) don't see color or race they only see their favorite characters. We see a Klingon rather then a black man in make-up, or we see the Emissary or a doctor. We don't see their race, not their human race anyway. We see what they, actors and wirters want us to see.

 

I had no idea he had a cameo appearance on TNG; had I not watched this featurette, I would have jumped out of my seat seeing Bashir on the Enterprise-D. I thought I had all my crossovers down.

That was a pretty good double episode of TNG, if you haven't seen it you should. It's called "Birthright". Part I is where Bashir is in it, the other plotline of the episode is Worf searching for his father on a Romulan world. Very good 2 parter, one of my favorites. An interesting side point on that episode, the Alien that takes Worf to the Romulan world is James Cromwell, who played Zephram Cochran in "First Contact". He played in sevral other episodes also, at least 2 others that I can think of. One DS9 and one TNG.

 

I wasn't expecting to learn a whole lot from just the crew dossiers, but the highlights and recaps were good to see. I learned a couple things... most notably Bashir's cameo appearance on TNG. And, to a lesser extent, Quark's (though that Ferengi probably wasn't "Quark"). I knew Ethan Phillips (Neelix, on Voyager) played a Ferengi in the TNG episode "Menage a Troi", but thought that was the only later-series character to appear on TNG, albeit as another character. Now I wouldn't be surprised if some of the DS9 and Voyager people played extras or small parts on TNG. I know Tim Russ (Tuvok) and Robert Picardo (The Doctor) from Voyager both had cameos on DS9 but that's different.

Jeffery Combs and Ethan Phillips also played Ferengi on Enterprise, that was a good episode.

 

Rene Auberjonois is a very good actor, my first memory of him in anything was in the early 80's sitcom Benson. He played "Clayton Runnymede Endicott III". He also played Reverend Oliver in the Mel Gibson movie "The Patriot". As for Trek roles he was in "Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country" and played "Colonel West" and played in an episode of Enterprise he was "Ezral" in the season 1 episode "Oasis".

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Rene Auberjonois is a very good actor, my first memory of him in anything was in the early 80's sitcom Benson. He played "Clayton Runnymede Endicott III".

 

Fast fact: Endicott is Reg Barclay's middle name and it came from Auberjonios' character.

 

It was weird on Spike today, I got Whispers and The Muse (when they are supposed to be in early season 7) and those episodes are not even sequential. One is from season 2 and the other is from season 4.

 

TNG was also weird with Devil's Due and Schisms and a third I didn't see. Bizarre.

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It was weird on Spike today, I got Whispers and The Muse (when they are supposed to be in early season 7) and those episodes are not even sequential. One is from season 2 and the other is from season 4.

 

TNG was also weird with Devil's Due and Schisms and a third I didn't see. Bizarre.

They probably did that because of Halloween, I had thought that Spike had already completed season 7 this time around though.

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MB - That's why you get Cable internet and a little program called BitTorrent... and a fairly big hard drive. Watching downloaded DVD rips has advantages over every other format, so far as I can tell. Against TV, it's obvious: I don't have to put up with commercials, I can pause on demand, I can skip the intro/credits, much better quality, and no station watermarking. Versus DVD, well, all the episodes are on a hard drive... no disc switching. No disc scratching either. Also the official DVDs pack a whopping three or four episodes per disc to keep costs high. Newsflash, a 4.7GB DVD+R disc will hold 11 episodes, I think... it's somewhere in the 10-13 range. Anyway, even with the extras, you only need 15 DVD+R discs, not the 40+ that come with the official pack, to back-up an entire Trek series.

 

Cable or DSL internet + BitTorrent + a big hard drive + a 50-pack of DVD+R discs = Trek Bliss

 

 

Not that big of a Trek fan to go to all that trouble really.

 

I watch it when I can, I have so much going on in my life, that I can't really do things like that. I have people I share a house and a tv with and I have to be respectful of their viewing time also.

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I have The Patriot on DVD. *checks it* Wow, Odo IS in it! I didn't particularly care for that film (spent too much time comparing it to Braveheart) but the next time I watch it, I'll have to look for him.

 

Speaking of Trek actors in 'regular' films, I noticed a movie called Descent on the new releases shelf at the video store. I had heard they were making a movie based on the 1990s first-person space-shooter of the same name at some point, but this was actually a ripoff of The Core... but I noticed Michael Dorn (Worf) is in it! Neat little fact... but it didn't stop me from putting it right back.

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I have The Patriot on DVD. *checks it* Wow, Odo IS in it! I didn't particularly care for that film (spent too much time comparing it to Braveheart) but the next time I watch it, I'll have to look for him.

 

Speaking of Trek actors in 'regular' films, I noticed a movie called Descent on the new releases shelf at the video store. I had heard they were making a movie based on the 1990s first-person space-shooter of the same name at some point, but this was actually a ripoff of The Core... but I noticed Michael Dorn (Worf) is in it! Neat little fact... but it didn't stop me from putting it right back.

I loved The Patriot, but that's because I have a strong interest in the American Revolution and I thought this was a great movie about that time.

 

I think I remember the movie you're talking about, though I've never seen it.

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Jadzia would have to win in a competition with Ezri, but I don't believe people give Ezri a fair shake. We just didn't have enough time to get to know her very well.

@TR: Of course I prefer Jadzia out of the two. How could I not? But Ezri only had one season, and that's not fair. Also, she didn't exactly get off to a great start... between the whiny stuff and her whole family being involved with the Orion Syndicate... No, she should have had a few episodes. Either they should have run DS9 10-11 seasons (they could have, easily) or they should have just let Jadzia live. Killing her really only served to get Sisko and Jake away from the station for a while.

I didn't give her a chance because I've made it no secret that Jadzia is the best thing on Trek and she should have never left. IMO they should not have even brought the Dax back at all if they were going to just give her one season.

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Jadzia would have to win in a competition with Ezri, but I don't believe people give Ezri a fair shake. We just didn't have enough time to get to know her very well.

@TR: Of course I prefer Jadzia out of the two. How could I not? But Ezri only had one season, and that's not fair. Also, she didn't exactly get off to a great start... between the whiny stuff and her whole family being involved with the Orion Syndicate... No, she should have had a few episodes. Either they should have run DS9 10-11 seasons (they could have, easily) or they should have just let Jadzia live. Killing her really only served to get Sisko and Jake away from the station for a while.

I didn't give her a chance because I've made it no secret that Jadzia is the best thing on Trek and she should have never left. IMO they should not have even brought the Dax back at all if they were going to just give her one season.

But there's no denying Ezri's "cuteness" factor... :blush:

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Ezri's a little too young-looking for my tastes.

 

I think they killed off Jadzia mainly to give Sisko a good reason to take a leave of absense, and for the dual purpose of creating conflict with Worf, that and bringing back a new Dax. It's not drama if it's always peaches and cream.

 

@VBG - Don't all Virginians have an interest in the American Revolution? :blush: I have a friend from Suffolk, VA, and he's a pretty big patriot, too. I've noticed that the farther east you get in the US (closer to the original 13 colonies) the more patriotic people are, the more serious they are about it. Likewise the concentration of civil war buffs is higher in the south. Now, I'm a patriot, I love my country, but not blindly by any means, and I just don't take it as seriously as most people. Seriously though, Mel Gibson's war trilogy (Braveheart, The Patriot, We Were Soldiers) are all great movies, I just saw too many similarities in the first two, and I loved Braveheart. I tend to take a negative outlook on movies that are very similar to movies that came before or out around the same time, e.g. Volcano/Dante's Peak, Bugs Life/Antz, Armageddon/Deep Impact, The Core/Descent... there's a good few more of them out there. I actually owned both (Braveheart and The Patriot) but Braveheart is one that was borrowed and never returned, and part of the reason I don't like lending out movies from my DVD collection.

 

Jadzia the best thing on Trek? Nah... A very good idea, a very good character exploration, but she's too much in line with Spock and Data to be "best". Spock may be the best thing on Trek; though I'm no TOS fan, I can't deny that the three series I do like have all copied his character (Data, Dax, Tuvok/Holodoc), so the producers must have thought he was pretty special. Don't get me wrong, I really liked Dax, but to say Jadzia is the best aspect of Trek... nah.

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Ezri's a little too young-looking for my tastes.

 

I think they killed off Jadzia mainly to give Sisko a good reason to take a leave of absense, and for the dual purpose of creating conflict with Worf, that and bringing back a new Dax. It's not drama if it's always peaches and cream.

 

@VBG - Don't all Virginians have an interest in the American Revolution? :blush: I have a friend from Suffolk, VA, and he's a pretty big patriot, too. I've noticed that the farther east you get in the US (closer to the original 13 colonies) the more patriotic people are, the more serious they are about it. Likewise the concentration of civil war buffs is higher in the south. Now, I'm a patriot, I love my country, but not blindly by any means, and I just don't take it as seriously as most people. Seriously though, Mel Gibson's war trilogy (Braveheart, The Patriot, We Were Soldiers) are all great movies, I just saw too many similarities in the first two, and I loved Braveheart. I tend to take a negative outlook on movies that are very similar to movies that came before or out around the same time, e.g. Volcano/Dante's Peak, Bugs Life/Antz, Armageddon/Deep Impact, The Core/Descent... there's a good few more of them out there. I actually owned both (Braveheart and The Patriot) but Braveheart is one that was borrowed and never returned, and part of the reason I don't like lending out movies from my DVD collection.

 

Jadzia the best thing on Trek? Nah... A very good idea, a very good character exploration, but she's too much in line with Spock and Data to be "best". Spock may be the best thing on Trek; though I'm no TOS fan, I can't deny that the three series I do like have all copied his character (Data, Dax, Tuvok/Holodoc), so the producers must have thought he was pretty special. Don't get me wrong, I really liked Dax, but to say Jadzia is the best aspect of Trek... nah.

 

I'm actually a Marylander by birth, I lived there for the first 19 years of my life before going in the Army. I've only been a Virginian for about 15 years. For me my interest is mainly an interest in American history and an interest in American military history. My interest for the Revolution is much stronger then my interest in the Civil War, I have a brother that is the opposite though. He's even written a movie script about the Civil War, if it wasn't for The Patriot I'd push him to write one for the Revolution lol.

 

As for Ezri being too young, in 1999 when she was on the show she was 29 so she's only a year younger then me.

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But there's no denying Ezri's "cuteness" factor... :vbg:

Eh... I guess her hairstyle is a bit attactive :laugh:

 

Ezri's a little too young-looking for my tastes.

 

I think they killed off Jadzia mainly to give Sisko a good reason to take a leave of absense, and for the dual purpose of creating conflict with Worf, that and bringing back a new Dax. It's not drama if it's always peaches and cream.

But why Jadzia? :tear: I know it was Terry's doing, but they should have FORCED her to stay! :angry: She should have also been on First Contact too. I mean, she was Worf's G/F during FC! She should have been part of the Defiant's bridge crew. It would have made perfect sense!

 

Jadzia the best thing on Trek? Nah... A very good idea, a very good character exploration, but she's too much in line with Spock and Data to be "best". Spock may be the best thing on Trek; though I'm no TOS fan, I can't deny that the three series I do like have all copied his character (Data, Dax, Tuvok/Holodoc), so the producers must have thought he was pretty special. Don't get me wrong, I really liked Dax, but to say Jadzia is the best aspect of Trek... nah.

You deny Jadzia's GREATNESS?!?! :blush:

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I do not deny Jadzia's greatness, just the absoluteness of it. :blush:

 

I didn't know Terry Farrel wanted off the show. If that was the case, killing her off is a great way to do it. Like when Nana Visitor got pregnant, they did that thing with the O'Brien's baby, so she wouldn't have to hide it.

 

Now that you mention First Contact, when did that take place? Worf was in all four TNG films... I have no idea where DS9 fits with all that. I assume it goes TNG-DS9 ep.1-Generations (since the Ent-D is in Ep.1 and it's destroyed in Generations) and I know First Contact is after DS9's fourth season starts (Worf has the Defiant, nuff said) but beyond that I don't get it.

 

Back to VBG... Ah, the Army... that too will do it. Actually I liked history a lot in high school, but lost some interest afterward. Did your brother's script ever get made into a movie? Or is he still trying for that? I'm not much for war films, but if I saw another one, I'd like to see one for the Civil War... I think I've seen one for just about every major conflict but the last two... I had a friend who was in the Army in the early 80s, and he loves war movies... I guess they kind of go together. Other than Braveheart and maybe one or two others, the names of which are presently escaping me... I don't much care for war movies. As far as military drama, though... the first part of "Full Metal Jacket" rocks, "The General's Daughter" was pretty good... anyway, I'm getting a bit offtopic... :angry:

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Now that you mention First Contact, when did that take place? Worf was in all four TNG films... I have no idea where DS9 fits with all that. I assume it goes TNG-DS9 ep.1-Generations (since the Ent-D is in Ep.1 and it's destroyed in Generations) and I know First Contact is after DS9's fourth season starts (Worf has the Defiant, nuff said) but beyond that I don't get it.

It falls somewhere between Children of Time and Empok Nor in terms of date, but is referenced in In Purgatory's Shadow, which is before those two episodes.

 

Insurrection worked out a little better, I believe. It is concurrent with DS9's Its Only a Paper Moon and Prodigal Daughter. Worf only appears in the beginning of IOAPM and the end scenes of PD and those episodes are set 3 weeks apart, giving him enough time to be at Manzar colony and join the Enterprise-E.

 

I love Memory Alpha.

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