Which type ships were involved...

[Wishfire 2]

Does anyone know which class of ships were used in the Borg encounter at Wolf 359?

 

I know that there was at least one refitted Constitution-class ship. I'm not sure about the others.

[Jack_Bauer 1]

According to Ex Astris Scientia, the following classes were present (officially):

Ambassador

Apollo

Challenger

Cheyenne

Excelsior

Freedom

Miranda

Nebula

New Orleans

Niagara

Oberth

Rigel

Springfield

 

There are also 5 Excelsior study models, 1 Proto Nebula, 1 Constitution, and 2 study models of the Phase II Enterprise in the debris field.

 

Here's the link:

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/wolf359.htm

[MrPsychic 1]

Basically it sounds like it was just a random group of starships. In First Contact, at least they had a real fleet assembled.

[Jack_Bauer 1]

When you think about it, the Borg were probably one of the best things to happen to the Federation. They forced the Federation to develop new and better ship designs and technologies.

 

It took a very long time for the Federation to rally a fleet of 40 to fight at Wolf 359, but a much better (and presumably larger) fleet was rallied in 2373 and that fleet was more successful.

[MrPsychic 1]

When you think about it, the Borg were probably one of the best things to happen to the Federation. They forced the Federation to develop new and better ship designs and technologies.

304987[/snapback]

Just like wars here on Earth. World War II gave us a lot of new technologies, such as radar and advanced medicines. In that aspect, sometimes war is good for business, just as the Ferengi say

[ussacclaim 0]

When you think about it, the Borg were probably one of the best things to happen to the Federation. They forced the Federation to develop new and better ship designs and technologies.

 

It took a very long time for the Federation to rally a fleet of 40 to fight at Wolf 359, but a much better (and presumably larger) fleet was rallied in 2373 and that fleet was more successful.

304987[/snapback]

 

Yeah, the second fleet had to engage the Borg starting at the Typhon sector. If that's near the Typhon expanse, that's a pretty long way for a fight. I'm looking at the Star Charts book as reference just for the record. Does anyone know where the Typhon sector is?

 

As for the fleet at Wolf 359, yeah, it was basically a kit-basher's paradise. In Emissary I saw a Miranda variant, Ambassador, Excelsior, and an Oberth. I got cheated too because Spike cuts out some of the episode in the afternoons so I missed a few seconds of the fight! Oh well, there is always the DVD's.

[MrPsychic 1]

What I don't get is what an Oberth class ship, it's a basically a science ship... Starfleet must have been scraping the bottom of the barrel for that to come in.

[Jack_Bauer 1]

What I don't get is what an Oberth class ship, it's a basically a science ship...  Starfleet must have been scraping the bottom of the barrel for that to come in.

305113[/snapback]

 

Agreed, Oberth class ships were basically cannon fodder during TNG.

[Captain Ericks 0]

When you think about it, the Borg were probably one of the best things to happen to the Federation. They forced the Federation to develop new and better ship designs and technologies.

 

It took a very long time for the Federation to rally a fleet of 40 to fight at Wolf 359, but a much better (and presumably larger) fleet was rallied in 2373 and that fleet was more successful.

304987[/snapback]

 

I agree toatlly. Think how screwed they would have been against the Dominion if they were going up against them with Excelsior and Constitution class ships backing up Galaxy class ships.

 

Instead Galaxy class vessels were backing up Defiant, Akira, and Soveriegn class ships.

 

Quite the upgrade.

[HRH The KING 0]

In the episode "The Best Of Both Worlds", they basically used any old junk models they had laying around, study models and a few ghastly kitbashes to show the "debris field" which the Enterprise encountered after the battle.

 

When we actually saw the Battle Of Wolf 359 in "Emissary" they were able to expand it slightly and we saw the Starships Bellerephon, Yamaguchi, Melbourne and Saratoga in combat.

 

We DID see an Oberth being blasted apart through the Saratoga's windows. It's assumed that this vessel was the Starship Bonestell. The reason a lightly armed science ship was involved in a battle I've heard could have been that it was already in the Wolf 359 star system when the call went out for any available Federation vessels in the region to assemble to confront the Borg.

 

In "ST: First Contact" they had a much larger budget to create a larger fleet for the Battle Of Sector 001. That's why we saw Nebulas, the Defiant, Mirandas, plus the new ships designed by Alex Jaeger at ILM, the Norway (USS Budapest), Steamrunner (USS Hiroshima), Sabre (USS Yeager) and Akira (USS Thunderchild) classes, in addition of course to the Enterprise-E.

 

Another class of ship known as "Zandura" was supposed to be seen in First Contact's battle scene, but was dropped.

Edited February 23, 2005 by The King

[Jack_Bauer 1]

The Steamrunner present at Sector 001 was actually the Appalachia NCC-52136 (at least that is the name on the CGI model). The Hiroshima is a Steamrunner class but according to what I can find there is no canon listing for that ship.

 

According to comm chatter, the Lexington, the Endeavour, the Bozeman, and the Madison were also present.

 

Memory Alpha also states the following unidentified starships were present:

2 Miranda

2 Additional Akira

2 Addtional Norway

2 Additional Sabre

2 Addtional Steamrunner

and another Oberth class

 

Some other interesting behind the scenes stuff:

-The Norway never again appeared in any Star Trek series because the model was lost in a computer glitch.

-The Steamrunner was supposed to be called the Streamrunner but the r was accidently dropped at some point.

-The Endeavour was supposed to be a new design and play a larger role but that was later dropped.

[HRH The KING 0]

The Steamrunner present at Sector 001 was actually the Appalachia NCC-52136 (at least that is the name on the CGI model). The Hiroshima is a Steamrunner class but according to what I can find there is no canon listing for that ship.

 

Yeah this is a problem. Appalachia is given as the name of the vessel yet the Star Trek Encyclopedia refers to the ship as Hiroshima.

 

It's very odd. Unless both ships were involved in the battle.

Edited February 23, 2005 by The King

[Wishfire 2]

As for the Oberth being present at Wolf 359, could it be that it was there basically as a quick resupply ship? I mean, maybe it had a horde of extra torps and other engineering needs in it's stores, and was present simply to transfer torps for extended combat. (There's got to be at least one starbase somewhere nearby, if not any battle-ready cruisers.)

[Jack_Bauer 1]

The Steamrunner present at Sector 001 was actually the Appalachia NCC-52136 (at least that is the name on the CGI model). The Hiroshima is a Steamrunner class but according to what I can find there is no canon listing for that ship.

 

Yeah this is a problem. Appalachia is given as the name of the vessel yet the Star Trek Encyclopedia refers to the ship as Hiroshima.

 

It's very odd. Unless both ships were involved in the battle.

305414[/snapback]

Which Star Trek Encyclopedia? I have the second edition (the blue one) and it refers to the ship as the Appalachia. Since there are 2 other unknown Steamruners, one of those could easily be the Hiroshima.

[MrPsychic 1]

I have the third edition and it also refers to that Steamrunner as the Appalachia

[ussacclaim 0]

What I don't get is what an Oberth class ship, it's a basically a science ship...  Starfleet must have been scraping the bottom of the barrel for that to come in.

305113[/snapback]

 

Agreed, Oberth class ships were basically cannon fodder during TNG.

305132[/snapback]

 

 

Heck, Oberth's were cannon fodder in The Search for Spock!

 

I wish there was a way to see the entire Wolf 359 battle, or even the one from First Contact. Yeah I realize that the battles took a long time but I'd still like to see it. And without the cuts from area to area and ship to ship every second and wide angle shots. I'd like some nice close-up that stuck with a particular ship for a small while, you know a real in-depth thing. Not that would be neat.

[MrPsychic 1]

A show just about a battle would be a very expensive show, and not advance any story.

[ussacclaim 0]

A show just about a battle would be a very expensive show, and not advance any story.

305641[/snapback]

 

True, but it would have a historical contribution. And come on, you wouldn't like to see something like that?

 

Oh well, I still think it would be cool.

[Captain Ericks 0]

Interesting yes, but perhaps it's the project for a group of fans with access to CGI technology (which can't be that hard) to make the 'Battle of Wolf 359'

[Wishfire 2]

Interesting yes, but perhaps it's the project for a group of fans with access to CGI technology (which can't be that hard) to make the 'Battle of Wolf 359'

305900[/snapback]

 

It would also be cool, assuming we can figure out exactly which ships were there, to create a game based off of it. Or even a game in which players can participate in every major ST battle.

[HRH The KING 0]

It would also be cool, assuming we can figure out exactly which ships were there, to create a game based off of it. Or even a game in which players can participate in every major ST battle.

 

Excellent idea :P

[ussacclaim 0]

It would also be cool, assuming we can figure out exactly which ships were there, to create a game based off of it. Or even a game in which players can participate in every major ST battle.

 

Excellent idea :P

306051[/snapback]

 

Agreed! Where do I sign up?

 

That's one of the coolest things to do, re-enact Star Trek battles. In Bridge Commander I made several attempts (unsuccessful) to win the scenario in "Yesterday's Enterprise". Maybe it couldn't be done. B)

[Wishfire 2]

It would also be cool, assuming we can figure out exactly which ships were there, to create a game based off of it. Or even a game in which players can participate in every major ST battle.

 

Excellent idea :P

306051[/snapback]

 

Agreed! Where do I sign up?

 

That's one of the coolest things to do, re-enact Star Trek battles. In Bridge Commander I made several attempts (unsuccessful) to win the scenario in "Yesterday's Enterprise". Maybe it couldn't be done. B)

306062[/snapback]

 

How did you do that? Did you make several different scenarios to consider gravitational influences from the temporal rift?

[ussacclaim 0]

It would also be cool, assuming we can figure out exactly which ships were there, to create a game based off of it. Or even a game in which players can participate in every major ST battle.

 

Excellent idea :biggrin:

306051[/snapback]

 

Agreed! Where do I sign up?

 

That's one of the coolest things to do, re-enact Star Trek battles. In Bridge Commander I made several attempts (unsuccessful) to win the scenario in "Yesterday's Enterprise". Maybe it couldn't be done. :lol:

306062[/snapback]

 

How did you do that? Did you make several different scenarios to consider gravitational influences from the temporal rift?

306064[/snapback]

 

No, I just played the battle as a Galaxy-class vessel. I added an Ambassador-class to escort and then I put in three Klingon Bird's of Prey as enemies. I only tried it a few times and I have yet to destroy even on Klingon ship. But I was firing and piloting manually. Maybe if I switch it to automatic I could do better, I'll have to experiment.

[MrPsychic 1]

Perhaps it's another Kobayashi Maru scenario. Picard did say to Garrett that Starfleet predicted they would lose in 6 months.

[borgdrone222 0]

thats a good question, i dont know