deagletime 1 Posted May 8, 2003 Click for Spoiler: hmm well perhaps denuoblin physiology can withstand omicron radiation while humans cannot second im curious what the repercutions of the borg wrekage now that starfleet has there hands on it.... im assuming that the unknown material was borg ablative plating and the unusual warp coils were transwarp coils??? further (and sisters back me up here) with data on the 1701-d im sure that he would have found some reference in some database on the "mysterious" cybernetic organisms that were found in the artic circle.... while the episode was great to say the least, im thinking that the timeline as we know it has been drastically altered...(say it aint so) and where has the temporal directive cops..uss relativity been through all this???? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob 0 Posted May 8, 2003 I felt the same way when Archer and T'Pol were discussing that. I thought they did such an excellent job in keeping the timeline intact. Great episode. I agree, they did do an excellent job of keeping it intact, because if you remember on an episode of Voyager someone, I think Janeway said that even before the Enterprise D's first meeting with the Borg, that Starfleet already had some knowledge of the Borg, thats why the Hansens were sent on that mission to study them. So this episode could be the begining, thats how Starfleet knew of the Borg, thats why the Hansens were sent on that mission. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deagletime 1 Posted May 8, 2003 ahhhha now that finally makes sense...cause i wondered if the timeline had been altered Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stelfan 0 Posted May 8, 2003 Click for Spoiler: I agree the part about Phlox hearing the message was a good touch. That's also a very good question about the technology they left behind - surely there had to be something if just hull plating. Wasn't it supposed to be Q - that introduced humanity to the Borg or did VOY alter that with Seven of Nine? Click for Spoiler: Q introduces The Borg to Picard in Q Who? in the second season, but this was before they travel back in time to destroy the borg cube in First Contact. Maybe this message will reach the Delta Quadrant before Q is supposed to introduce them, that way we could be in trouble in the future :o Voyager is after TNG in timeline, so the Voy crew already knew about the borg.. Regarding Regeneration, I think it was the next best episode yet to be shown on Enterprise (after the Cogenitor), resistance is futile once again! Wooowww!! Click for Spoiler: My only complaint is that they defeated them a little to easy, they should have adapted to the phasers a lot quicker, they shouldn't have been able to take out that many.. Otherwise the feeling was there, a GREAT EPISODE! I give it a 9/10.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stelfan 0 Posted May 8, 2003 Click for Spoiler: hmm well perhaps denuoblin physiology can withstand omicron radiation while humans cannot second im curious what the repercutions of the borg wrekage now that starfleet has there hands on it.... im assuming that the unknown material was borg ablative plating and the unusual warp coils were transwarp coils??? further (and sisters back me up here) with data on the 1701-d im sure that he would have found some reference in some database on the "mysterious" cybernetic organisms that were found in the artic circle.... while the episode was great to say the least, im thinking that the timeline as we know it has been drastically altered...(say it aint so) and where has the temporal directive cops..uss relativity been through all this???? Click for Spoiler: You are very right that Data probably should find it. And I probably has now, as the timeline must have been changed. But this is not at all Enterprises fault, it started with ENT-D destroying the borg cube. And I do agree that the temporal directive cops should have gone back to destroy all the debris that landed in the arctic, but they didn't, for some reason, and with that we could have a great episode!! I'm not complaining! :o Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stelfan 0 Posted May 8, 2003 I felt the same way when Archer and T'Pol were discussing that. I thought they did such an excellent job in keeping the timeline intact. Great episode. I agree, they did do an excellent job of keeping it intact, because if you remember on an episode of Voyager someone, I think Janeway said that even before the Enterprise D's first meeting with the Borg, that Starfleet already had some knowledge of the Borg, thats why the Hansens were sent on that mission to study them. So this episode could be the begining, thats how Starfleet knew of the Borg, thats why the Hansens were sent on that mission. You're right, they did mention something about why they sent the Hansens. I think Regeneration was my second fav. episode so far, but definitely the most exciting one!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Takara_Soong 4 Posted May 8, 2003 Click for Spoiler: hmm well perhaps denuoblin physiology can withstand omicron radiation while humans cannot further (and sisters back me up here) with data on the 1701-d im sure that he would have found some reference in some database on the "mysterious" cybernetic organisms that were found in the artic circle.... Click for Spoiler: I agree with your hypothesis regarding Phlox. He did say that the nanotechnology was having difficulties with his immune system so the process of assimilation was slower on him than the others. I'm not sure Data would be able to find it by searching for cybernetic organisms. I did a quick search with Google of the words cybernetic organism and it came up with 5,620 hits. As the Borg were unnamed I think it would have been exceedingly difficult to adequately define search parameters but with enough time it wouldn't have been impossible for Data. Also remember in The Nake Now how it was going to take Data hours to find the reference to the Psi 2000 virus until Riker remembered the connection to Enterprise history. I think it would have once again been like searching for the proverbial needle in the haystack situation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ddillard 2 Posted May 8, 2003 I was just watching the episode again and I thought of something. Click for Spoiler: Why would a human science team on earth have a science vessel that was equipped for warp space travel? It would make more since for then to have been using shuttles, or orbital craft. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
prometheus 0 Posted May 8, 2003 Goodness gracious! What a lot of twisted overtinking! I see some people here have all the answers as usual. I personally dont care how this episode will fit into the continuity and see it as a cheap attempt to try to win ratings. If the Borg Queen pops up again with fingernails at the ready I swear! Enterprise is finished for me. This isnt new. This isnt exciting. This is just taking a left over from a brilliant movie and evolving a whole episode out of it. Berman is breaking the rules and is relying on old stuff too much. Ok. It'll be interesting to see the Borg up against the Enterprise crew but that is all it will be. Not clever. Not inventive. Just cheap. After this, I dont want to see them again. :o Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xenexian 2 Posted May 8, 2003 Yes, you're absolutely right, that old Borg feeling is definetly back. I even embarrassed myself by screaming at the tv, as if they could hear me. In spite of some minor errors, I thought the writers did a great job on tying in everything necessary from all previous Borg episodes and FC, to have this one make sense. Like in "Times Arrow", time and history were fulfilling themselves and everything is as it should be. This was a landmark episode. The look on Archers face towards the end as he began to realize that this species presented far more then they could possibly handle was a perfect puncuation to this actual first meeting with the Borg. It's the first time that I actually saw fear register on all their faces. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poguemahone 0 Posted May 8, 2003 Goodness gracious! What a lot of twisted overtinking! I see some people here have all the answers as usual. I personally dont care how this episode will fit into the continuity and see it as a cheap attempt to try to win ratings. If the Borg Queen pops up again with fingernails at the ready I swear! Enterprise is finished for me. This isnt new. This isnt exciting. This is just taking a left over from a brilliant movie and evolving a whole episode out of it. Berman is breaking the rules and is relying on old stuff too much. Ok. It'll be interesting to see the Borg up against the Enterprise crew but that is all it will be. Not clever. Not inventive. Just cheap. After this, I dont want to see them again. :o We won't see the Borg again, it was a one shot deal, having the Borg on that way was the only way that made sense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poguemahone 0 Posted May 8, 2003 ***MOD'S NOTE*** Threads Merged Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xenexian 2 Posted May 8, 2003 with data on the 1701-d im sure that he would have found some reference in some database on the "mysterious" cybernetic organisms that were found in the artic circle.... Not if it became classified starfleet information. Not even Data would be permitted to access sensitive information regarding this dangerous species. Even during the first and second encounter with the Borg on TNG, no mention is ever made of the Hansens and their fact finding secret mission. Starflleet never bothered to tell Picard and crew, "oh, by the way, we have some interesting information for you thats about 200 years old that might interest you". Now that I think more about it, it's beginning to smell more and more like a coverup by Starfleet and was probably made so by the Hansens disappearance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob 0 Posted May 8, 2003 I've been wondering,... Click for Spoiler: Archer analized the data the borg sent to the borg of that era telling them how to find earth, T'Pol said that it would take atleast 200 years for the message to get to the delta quadrant, that takes us to the TNG epsiode where Q sent the Enterprise to J-25 was it? maybe Q didnt send them to meet the Borg, maybe he just sent them there to see how Picard would react and stuff, and since the message would take 200 years to reach the borg maybe the borg had already recieved the message and were on their way to earth when they encnountered The Enterprise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Syperphobia 0 Posted May 8, 2003 All these spoiler clicks are getting on my nerves. I really think that last nights episode was great although I really couldnt enjoy it as much as I wanted to due to personal matters. Not to drift from the subject, the suspense was excellent and it made me think about the next two back-to-back episodes. The first hour I am going to watch, but T'Pol getting Pon Far will make me throw up in gallons, we already know she is a beautiful actress why does she need to flaunt off her 'Vulcan Stuff' to humans. I would think that they would of at least saved it for the seventh season, why didnt she take care of this problem before going on the ship? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1 Posted May 8, 2003 Ahane, the whole point of the "spoiler" button is so people can come read about the episode, but not worry about it being spoiled in case they missed it. She can't "take care of the problem" when she wants. With Vulcans, Pon Farr is on a 7-year-timer. They don't have control of when it happens. I've been wondering,... Click for Spoiler: Archer analized the data the borg sent to the borg of that era telling them how to find earth, T'Pol said that it would take atleast 200 years for the message to get to the delta quadrant, that takes us to the TNG epsiode where Q sent the Enterprise to J-25 was it? maybe Q didnt send them to meet the Borg, maybe he just sent them there to see how Picard would react and stuff, and since the message would take 200 years to reach the borg maybe the borg had already recieved the message and were on their way to earth when they encnountered The Enterprise. Click for Spoiler: Seven's family, the Hansens, were assimilated in the 2350's, arround the time the message would reach the Delta Quadrant. Perhaps, that's when the Borg showed an interrest in humanity? I've allways wonderred why the Borg were so dang interrested in us. Perhaps this episode explains why? Big powerful 24th century Borg defeated by a little 22nd century Earth ship. Gotta peak their interrests in wonderring how powerful 24th century Earth is! :o Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Takara_Soong 4 Posted May 8, 2003 I've been wondering,... Click for Spoiler: Archer analized the data the borg sent to the borg of that era telling them how to find earth, T'Pol said that it would take atleast 200 years for the message to get to the delta quadrant, that takes us to the TNG epsiode where Q sent the Enterprise to J-25 was it? maybe Q didnt send them to meet the Borg, maybe he just sent them there to see how Picard would react and stuff, and since the message would take 200 years to reach the borg maybe the borg had already recieved the message and were on their way to earth when they encnountered The Enterprise. Click for Spoiler: I definitely believe the Borg in the Delta Quadrant got the message because of the destruction of the outposts in the first season TNG episode The Neutral Zone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cyphrx 0 Posted May 8, 2003 John Carpenter's It. you mean stephen kings IT, or john carpenters THE THING? the thing was an awsome movie, gotta watch that again, havent watched it in forever. Oops, I'm actually reading It right now and got it confused with Thing....he he :o Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A l t e r E g o 9 Posted May 8, 2003 All these spoiler clicks are getting on my nerves. So is needing to edit post which do not have them Can you say BUZZWORTHY? I liked it except for a point or two I will get to at the end. Click for Spoiler: cptwright,May 7 2003, 05:33 PM]the only real complaint i have, if you can call it that, is how fast tripp learned enough about their technology to disable it as quick as he did. but thats it. its about dang time they use the transporter. Click for Spoiler: SuraksSoul,May 7 2003, 06:45 PM]I also agree with everyone about the transporter -- it's becoming a more natural method of transportation for the crew. Or sooner then the end, :o Click for Spoiler: Trip and the technology is a valid question I have no answer for but yes, it was cool to see the transporter use increased now that the danger factor is increased to warrant the risk of using it. ----------------------------------- Click for Spoiler: worfo,May 7 2003, 08:31 PM]Hey all 1st tonights Eppisode was The best Enterprise eppisode so farNext remeber that felling we use to get when TNG was on and we saw the borg they were a bit scary and we were always on edge with them and your stomack would kind be in a knot of excitement at least it was for me. then voyager came along great show except they made the Borg look weak and took the fear out of them. Absolutely! I had white knuckles again! Regeneration is a very fitting and frightening introduction to the 'whoever they are' :o This being an introduction to them, I feel the title is wrong, ENT is a prequel and the title suggests foreknowledge but o well, to the unknowing it will be a mystery for sometime to come. ----------------------------- Click for Spoiler: ddillard,May 7 2003, 08:35 PM]I do have to wonder though about the Borg technology that was left behind. Did the Borg use all of it to modify the ship, or was some left on earth? If it was left on earth, would our scientists not analyze it further? Click for Spoiler: Good question. Someone has suggested a paradox because of REG and wouldn’t it be funny if the Technology of the Borg sphere remains leads to reverse engineering and the beginnings of future Starfleet Technology used to defeat their plans in the far future? Hahahaha!I remember thinking when all of the debris was shown; 'That’s a hell of a lot more wreckage than I had been thinking we would see.' --------------------------------- Click for Spoiler: That's what Q thinks, as I highly doubt that he was watching Humans during this time so he wouldn't know that humanity have met the Borg, since there is no reason for him to believe they did when he knows they're supposed to be in Delta Quadrant Click for Spoiler: Stelfan,May 8 2003, 03:44 AM]Q introduces The Borg to Picard in Q Who? in the second season, but this was before they travel back in time to destroy the borg cube in First Contact. Maybe this message will reach the Delta Quadrant before Q is supposed to introduce them, that way we could be in trouble in the future Click for Spoiler: Rob,May 8 2003, 06:55 AM]I've been wondering,...Archer analized the data the borg sent to the borg of that era telling them how to find earth, T'Pol said that it would take atleast 200 years for the message to get to the delta quadrant, that takes us to the TNG epsiode where Q sent the Enterprise to J-25 was it? maybe Q didnt send them to meet the Borg, maybe he just sent them there to see how Picard would react and stuff, and since the message would take 200 years to reach the borg maybe the borg had already recieved the message and were on their way to earth when they encnountered The Enterprise. Click for Spoiler: Ah-ha! Here is where it heats up, I think Q knew the Borg were coming and caused the early contact with the Borg to SAVE HUMANITY! If he had not interfered, we would all be wearing the latest Borg Fashions! --------------------------------- Click for Spoiler: VaBeachGuy,May 8 2003, 12:29 AM]I too thought it was a great Episode!My only "complaint" would be that on Enterprise ehrn the security officers were shooting the Borg and Archer and Reed were on the Borg ship why didn't Archer's Borg learn to adapt to the phasers at the same time the Enterprise Borg learned to adapt? Being a collective mind once one Borg learns to adapt they all know how to, right? I guess they still had "sleepy head thinking." :o ---------------------------------- Click for Spoiler: As for why Phlox was able to discover that Radiation was effective against the Nano-probes and Crusher or any of the future doctors couldn't? Well I can't recall an instance where a "future" doctor was able to study assimilation from it's beginning stages the way Phlox was able to. He got the aliens while they were still "Themselves". That's my take on it anyway. Good theory, I’ll buy that, perfect example of ENT not just being a rehash but also doing things with the characters and plotlines that have never been done before. Kudos to ENT! ------------------------------------------- Click for Spoiler: Another thing I was waiting to see how they handled it, when the Borg ship hailed Enterprise, the only thing they said was: "You Will Be Assimilated. Resistance is Futile." No mention that "We Are The Borg". That saves the timeline and shuts the naysayers up... LOL Sleepyhead Borg again! :o ----------------------------------- Goodness gracious! What a lot of twisted overtinking! I see some people here have all the answers as usual. I think that is the point of using message boards and yes; we do have all of the answers! with data on the 1701-d im sure that he would have found some reference in some database on the "mysterious" cybernetic organisms that were found in the artic circle.... Not if it became classified starfleet information. Not even Data would be permitted to access sensitive information regarding this dangerous species. Even during the first and second encounter with the Borg on TNG, no mention is ever made of the Hansens and their fact finding secret mission. Starflleet never bothered to tell Picard and crew, "oh, by the way, we have some interesting information for you thats about 200 years old that might interest you". Now that I think more about it, it's beginning to smell more and more like a coverup by Starfleet and was probably made so by the Hansens disappearance. I agree, Section 31 is the one best solution to any question of Why didn’t it happen on TOS. -------------------------------------- Captain Picard; Click for Spoiler: Except that the fact they were defeated by the humans was not included in the message. ------------------------------------- Now to my question; Click for Spoiler: wasn’t the ENT supposed to be two years (at maximum warp) away from Earth? It was strange how the transport... (Btw, that is why the transport had warp drive, it needed to hurry to meet with Archer.) ...and ENT were suddenly in the same neighborhood. ------------------------------- All said and done I did enjoy it on a few different levels, it answered a question or two and raised some other good ones as food for thought, I am going to give it a first impressions score of 7 and ¾. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
removed 0 Posted May 8, 2003 rewatched it last night: iit DID explain the timeline. i think i just missed it. and the borg message to take 200 years was cool. i liked it alot. id like to re-rate it: 9.5/10 while i was watching it the first time i was also discussing it with a friend so i missed alot. the second time was better because i saw everything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poguemahone 0 Posted May 8, 2003 I forgot to rate it, 9.5 out of 10 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
harpm1 0 Posted May 8, 2003 Wow! Big thread. I would have posted more today except all the time I took reading this puppy. Anyway, loved the episode and it was truly tense. 9/10!!! Click for Spoiler: OK, the conscern over the whole Q thing is I think the Federation did not know of the whole Borg thing in general except for perhaps old rumors or in that special Section of Secret operations. I beleive 7 of 9's family set out to study the Borg after the Enterprise had their encounter and so it was still Q who introduced the term "Borg" because he knew they would get the message and were eventually heading Earth bound very soon. Q had in fact been watching Earth for all time because the Q have no sense of time as we do. Remember his vast knowledge of our history and ability to time travel. Cockrin's message totally fit for me and made sense as to giving Archer a definite reason to destroy the transport. And I for a few moments thought the Doc was going to bite the dust. I was a little sad to say the least. OK, so now my brain hurts. Great Show thumbs up, but I hope this is the last time we see those cybernetic baddies as it would take away from TNG. In my humble opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
removed 0 Posted May 8, 2003 She can't "take care of the problem" when she wants. With Vulcans, Pon Farr is on a 7-year-timer. They don't have control of when it happens. i was under the impression from st3 that pon farr only happened to male vulcans. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Jean-Luc Picard 1 Posted May 8, 2003 She can't "take care of the problem" when she wants. With Vulcans, Pon Farr is on a 7-year-timer. They don't have control of when it happens. i was under the impression from st3 that pon farr only happened to male vulcans. How's that? Just becuase Spock's regenerated body was going through Pon Farr and Savvik decided to "ya know" with him doesn't mean female Vulcans don't go through Pon Farr. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poguemahone 0 Posted May 8, 2003 She can't "take care of the problem" when she wants. With Vulcans, Pon Farr is on a 7-year-timer. They don't have control of when it happens. i was under the impression from st3 that pon farr only happened to male vulcans. How's that? Just becuase Spock's regenerated body was going through Pon Farr and Savvik decided to "ya know" with him doesn't mean female Vulcans don't go through Pon Farr. Correct, Pon Farr is just a period every seven years a Vulcan goes into heat, it can be a he/she, it's just until next week it's only been men shown going through it (Spock/Tuvok) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A l t e r E g o 9 Posted May 8, 2003 To the best of my memory it has NEVER been said if VUL females go into heat or not so T’Pol doing it on ENT violates nothing. Also, if you look at TOS Amok Time, ask yourself if you don’t think Stonn eased T'Prings pain. From the way he stands back there all shifty eyed as T'Pring explains how the situation has changed, I would be surprised to find they had not rubbed goop together! AND! If it were not possible for Melded couples to cheat on each other, why would there even be a Challenge??? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deagletime 1 Posted May 9, 2003 alterego...phew quite a reply...but again the question remains, what about the wreckage and the effects on the.. timeline....ablative armor and transwarp coils...whats the deal i i do recall them saying that they had a few more borg left in the freezer...is it possible they might be left too? and what about the inert nanoprobes that were floating in phoxes blood and the borg technology that was left in that plasma relay junction? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
~Crims~ 0 Posted May 9, 2003 alterego...phew quite a reply...but again the question remains, what about the wreckage and the effects on the.. timeline....ablative armor and transwarp coils...whats the deal i i do recall them saying that they had a few more borg left in the freezer...is it possible they might be left too? and what about the inert nanoprobes that were floating in phoxes blood and the borg technology that was left in that plasma relay junction? I think the best answer to that is see how it plays out. I have a feeling there will be an episode where Phlox starts to turn back into a drone and tries to assimilate Enterprise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
