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Captain Jean-Luc Picard

Season 7

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:laugh: Greetings to you Captain I think a great discussion could center around season seven of Voyager. I must tell you that while I did enjoy the story line in Unimatrix Zero and how it completed Part I from the former season; this was not my favorite episode. One of the flaws I thought in that episode was how Captain Janeway, B'Elanna and Tuvok's borg implants were able to be removed instataneously. As I recall when Seven of Nine came on board she had to undergo operations and other serious medical procedures before she could even begin to regain her humanity. It was a very major transformation for her. So I just didn;t make sense that it was so differnent for The Captain, B'Elanna and Tuvok........just my opinion. :laugh:

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The hadn't become dependent on their Borg Implants. Seven had. Picard didn't have any trouble getting his removed either. Seven had been a borg for what?? 20 years?? Torres, Janeway, Tuvok, and Picard were borg for what?? A few Days??

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I couldnt believe that someone could let themselves be assimilated and come out so unscathed. Even if they had done something to retain their consciousness, seeing yourself be injected and cut up and stuff...urgh! Very traumatic. And frightening. As i've stated it was all Borg for the end of Voyager. Without this staple of The Next Generation Voyager would have had to rely on some other plot which may have been more original. Bringing back a Caretaker would have been better for me. The whole idea of coming full circle would have been good. There was just no resolution to that whole Caretaker thing for me which wasnt very satisfying. i would have liked it if a search for a Caretaker would have been a subsidiary aim of Voyager's return journey. Also, the domesticity of Tom and B'llana annoyed me. An unlikely match in seven and Chakotay and that Irish Village (i'm from Ireland! That was dire) were all too much. No, I think it ended at a good time. Mid seasons were best for me. The end was just getting too much. Oh no, not Barclay AGAIN!!!!

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Hey, I liked "Endgame"! It was an awesome episode! I had an idea that Voyager would be following a Borg invasion, say 3 cubes, back to Earth, and some how save the day at the same time! Well, they did use Borg technology, the transwarp hub, to get home. So, in a way, they used my idea! :laugh:

 

I also liked how B'Elanna was giving birth to her baby in the finale, allthough I would have preferred "Renassiance Man" to have been about B'Elanna's birth instead of squeezing it in the finale. That's really the only thing I would have changed.

 

I allways wanted to have Janeway and Chakotay get together in a relationship either when they got home or by the series finale. Bu, OH NO, Seven had to steal Chakotay's heart! :laugh: Welp, they do make a good couple, excellent acting from both Mr. Beltran and Mrs. Ryan! (Didn't Brannon Braga and Jeri Ryan get married?)

 

I loved how Admiral Janeway got assimilated... then it turned out she had a virus in her blood, thus infecting the Borg! Brilliant! I deffinately didn't see that coming.

 

Sure, it was rushed, but I still loved it.

 

Things I would have changed:

 

"Renassiance Man" would have been about B'Elanna giving birth to Miral instead of another Doctor episode.

 

Seven would have contacted Neelix, telling him they were going home. (So we actually know it happened!)

 

Instead of a fade out with Voyager heading toward Earth... We get to see Voyager land, then end credits.

 

Other than that, the episode rocked!

 

 

Oh, here's a question: What did you all think of Admiral Janeway's future shuttle?

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I think the Borg usage was weak. The last episode was very prdictable. I think everyone predicted that the Borg would have some part to play in it. As for a future Janeway, i still think that a paradox was created. I mean, Voyager ended up in an alternate future not unlike the one that Biff created in Back to the Future 2. Janeway changed history which is not a good thing. She violated the temporal prime directive and exceptions should never be made. I would have liked CAPTAIN Janeway to get home by herself and not some alternate future version getting all the credit. I dont think the shuttle looked futuristic enough apart from the plating and stuff.

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I think the Borg usage was weak. The last episode was very prdictable. I think everyone predicted that the Borg would have some part to play in it.

 

I agree they missed out on the storyline’s potential. From the very first sighting of the Borg on VOY I began putting together a theory of how the series finale could be a cliffhanger springboard into a mixed cast feature film which would deal a devastating blow to the Borg, get VOY home (well that did happen) and Sisko out of the wormhole all in one fell swoop but alas... :tear: they blew it.

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prometheus,

 

"Captain" Janeway did get the crew home. Took them 23 years. However, after the death of Seven, Tuvok's insanity, and the later death of Chakotay, Admiral Janeway decided that wasn't good enough, so she travelled back in time to get the ship home sooner. That's what the story was about. Getting home now instead of 16 years from them. So, wether she be from the present or the future, Janeway is Janeway, and Janeway helped get Voyager home.

 

True, Voyager did end up in a different future, but the moment Admiral Janeway enterred the past, her future was no longer of consequence as it was no longer written in stone. She alterred time, so that her crew wouldn't have to spend another 16 years in the Delta Quadrant.

 

Alterego,

How come you wanted them to get Sisko out of the wormhole? DS9 and VOY have nothing to do with eachother aside from Quark's cameo in Voyager's pilot, and 2 VOY characters quest starring on DS9.

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you know what has always eluded me?? after the voyagenerians have helped the unimatrixians regain conciousness in the real world, doesnt a sphere controlled by liberated unimatrixians come an aid them in battle .... no argument yet right? would it hurt if they said something like "we liberated u unimatrixian peoples, would u mine terribly if we carpool with u to the alpha quadrant in one of your transwarp corridors?" if it was me.. i woulda asked???!!?!

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I had actually heard that they originally decided to get Voyager home at the start of season 7... then in the middle with a 2-parter... then with the final episodes... then the series finale... then finally decided that the last few mins of the finale should be Voyager arriving toward Earth.

 

Anywho, yeah... why didn't they ask if they could piggyback? If the sphere needed to go and liberrate other drones... why didn't they ask for at least one transwarp coil? Could'a gotten them all the way to the Beta Quadrant! :tear:

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Here is a question to think about.... If future Janeway did not come back to resuce Voyager, what further enemies would the ship had to face. With knowning that Voyager would of gotten home, do you think it was worth the risk of sending Voyager back prematuraly. Think of all the vast knowledge that Voyager would of recieved with an extra accumliatve years. Of course they would of had crew members that would of died, espcially Seven then Chakotay and then Tvock's illness... but isnt the gain of knowledge the worth of risks to possess them?

 

 

Note: If anyone is a mythology fan, Odin lost his eye just for the gain of knowledge; knowledge is power and with the knowledge obtained set at a regular date, it could make the Federation grow naturally than with the advanced technology leap. Think of all the major risk factors for other hostile species to gain that advanced technology that updated Voyager

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Perhaps, but their primary goal was to return to Earth, explorration was a secondary goal. So, I kinda lean towards Admiral Janeway's decission to bring the ship home early. However, it does bring up severe Temporal Prime Directive issues! :tear:

 

Keep in mind that with knowledge, comes great responsibility and sometimes... the outcome can be disastrous!

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Catain Jean Luc Picard.

 

In response TO YOUR OPINION on the time line and so forth I say this. Admiral Janeway's life was crap. Well does that give her the right to go back in time to change it? If so then it would be ok for everyone to go back in time and feed their past selves information about the future to improve their lives. This would distort the timeline no end. No. She violated the temporal prime directive. She never thought about the consequences of her actions. By altering the future she could have wiped out thousands of lives and done untold damage. We know what the future should have been because we saw it for ourselves. All to save her crew.

 

This is my opinion.

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prometheus,

 

I see 2 points of view:

 

Janeway:

26 years later, after the death of Seven, Tuvok's insanity, the death of Chakotay, and the celebration of 10 years after Voyager arrived home... She felt she needed to go back in time, to bring her crew home while they were still young... and to save the lives of her crew, including those closest to her.

 

Temporal Prime Directive:

What Janeway did was erase 26 years of history. With Voyager arriving home 16 years early and with future technology, there's no telling on how the future will turn out compared to the previous timeline. Janeway's allready had effects on people's lives like Captain Picard. What she has done, was a massive temporal violation. She should be cour martialled.

 

 

Then you have to remember one little thing: This isn't the 29th century, they don't have advanced time travel technology.

 

With that said, Captain Janeway didn't violate the Temporal Prime Directive, she did a devestating blow to the Borg and got her crew home. It was Admiral Janeway who violated the Temporal Prime Directive by alterring the past and helping Voyager arrive home 16 years early. With the lack of technology to merge the present and future Janeway into one person, and with the death of Admiral Janeway, I believe that Captain Janeway should not be held accountable for that which her future self's actions.

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Starfleet may see that differently.

 

Also, the Voyager crew would have got a lot bad stuff to get out of the way after all the celebrations when they got home. The former Maquis, the "Equinox Five", and all sorts of other paperwork. Additionally, they would have to figure out what to do with the armor and transphasic torpedo technologies.

 

We can already predict some of what happens after that. We already know that Janeway gets promoted. We can guess that a lot of the crew (Icheb, Seven, a lot of the Maquis bunch) will go to the Academy for a reduced amount of time.

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Starfleet may see that differently.

I agree, SF is removed from us by what, almost 200 years and a third World War. Some things are bound to be different from the way they are today.

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heres a question: if janeway was able to go back in time to get home earlier, why didnt she just go home earlier and prevent them from getting lost in the first place?

 

also, janeway sucks. lol. she never should have made admiral.

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Well, think about all they did in the Delta Quadrant. Neelix's jounry and finding his own people again, the devestation to the Borg, Seven's liberration, the destruction of the Equinox to save the aliens, destroying the Array to protect the Ocampa, and so forth.

 

My guess is she wanted to get them home after the Borg Rebellion but before Tuvok's illness became irreversible.

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Ok, Voyager in no way can get home before they ever went off and did their adventure because that is kinda pointless. If Admiral Janeway did that then the entire journey would be for nothing. Remember their speach: "To the journey". Janeway grew with the journey as so did everyone else on the crew. If she prevented the ship from ever going to the Delta Quadrant in the first place they could of had many bad results...

 

1. They would of never captured the lost Maquie group.

2. Tom Paris would of still been a convict and never grow up.

3. Harry would of never gained so much responsibility as an Ensgin.

4. EMH liberation would of never happened.

5. Seven of Nine would of never been rehabilitated

6. Need I list more :angry:

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ya. i guess. it just seems that if she had the ability to time travel, why not go to a better time again.

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I loveeee the episode of Shattered :laugh: one of my most favorites... Doesn't anyone notice that the Doctor was more abundent as a central theme character not just in season 7, but during all of Voyager seasons combined?

 

Don't get me wrong, I love the EMH, but they should of evenly divided up the story plots to feature more stars, like Harry Kim should of really showed his maturity in Season 7, rather than him being in random episodes like The Chute, and Nightengale

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The doctor got a lot of recoginizition not just with Seven, but as well with Kes when he needed a name, and when he wanted to be more human. Without his global emiter he was a "toy". I just would of loved to see more of :( Harry Kim B) in more episodes. Espically a major plot in Season Seven. "The Chute" seemed to be his biggest outbreak role

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The doctor got a lot of recoginizition not just with Seven, but as well with Kes when he needed a name, and when he wanted to be more human. Without his global emiter he was a "toy". I just would of loved to see more of  :( Harry Kim :bow:  in more episodes. Espically a major plot in Season Seven. "The Chute" seemed to be his biggest outbreak role

While there were some "Doctor" episodes durring the first 3 seasons, he wasn't heavilly featured till Seven joined the cast. Also, it's his mobile emitter, not global! B) I don't think he was a "toy" and he never wanted to be human. All he wanted was to escape sickbay and be treated as an equal. By the 4th season, he attained both. :bow:

 

As for Harry? I agree! B)

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Well, think about all they did in the Delta Quadrant.  Neelix's jounry and finding his own people again, the devestation to the Borg, Seven's liberration, the destruction of the Equinox to save the aliens, destroying the Array to protect the Ocampa, and so forth.

 

My guess is she wanted to get them home after the Borg Rebellion but before Tuvok's illness became irreversible.

I find it hard to believe that the only good things to have occurred took place in the first 7 years. There would bound to have been good things occuring afterwards as well. Also, if Janeway acted to save Tuvok's life then that would be an insult to all the other crewmembers' lives that were lost during the course of the show. It would seem that their's were not important enough to save.

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Well, think about all they did in the Delta Quadrant.  Neelix's jounry and finding his own people again, the devestation to the Borg, Seven's liberration, the destruction of the Equinox to save the aliens, destroying the Array to protect the Ocampa, and so forth.

 

My guess is she wanted to get them home after the Borg Rebellion but before Tuvok's illness became irreversible.

I find it hard to believe that the only good things to have occurred took place in the first 7 years. There would bound to have been good things occuring afterwards as well. Also, if Janeway acted to save Tuvok's life then that would be an insult to all the other crewmembers' lives that were lost during the course of the show. It would seem that their's were not important enough to save.

Perhaps, but I felt she had 2 motives to do what she did.

 

1. Prevent Seven's death, Tuvok's insanity, and Chakotay's miserrable life leading to a death shortly after arriving home. These were the closest people in her life, thus her judgement on the Temporal Prime Directive was clouded.

 

2. I also believe she wanted to get the ship home after the Borg rebellion had been started but before Seven's death and Tuvok's insanity, thus the time perriod she took was perfect.

 

In the end, it all boiled down to this: Janeway allways sacrificed a way home for the betterment of other species and so forth. I guess you could say she felt the galaxy owed her one. Besides, once she enterred the past, the future was no longer a certainty and only a possibility. It still happened, only it's been erased. It'd be like if you wrote a 10 page story, deleted the last 3 pages, and re-wrote them. You may have erased the last 3 pages and re-wrote them, but they were still written at one point.

 

Anywho, those are my thoughts.

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:laugh: One of my favorite episodes was FACES. It was an early episode in Season I. In this episode B'Ellanna is split into two personalities, one human and one Klingon. Of course each is at odds with the other, and struggles to understand and appreciate the other. But because of the crisis they find themselves in they are forced to work together. Towards the end the Klingon personality is mortally wounded trying to save the human B'Ellanna. Now the reason I especially liked the plotof this episode is because it truly helped me to understand her torments and struggles. It also led me to believe that at some point B'Ellanna would come to admire and apprecialate her Klingon ancestory more. I learned more about the human side of B'Ellanna, with the personalities split. I also liked how the episode concluded.......and Roxane Dawson did some very fine acting. :laugh:

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